i just watched the demo...

[doeman]

so i finally finished downloading all of the videos in HD. wouldn't think of any other way to watch the demo, but now that i have...

1. i gotta say, i'm disappointed in the battle transitions. all of the articles/interviews kept saying that the transitions would be "seamless", but they aren't. they're just really fast, that's all. FF12 was seamless. all this time, i thought that, once you come in contact with an enemy, the battle commands would appear on screen and battle would start right then and there. instead sadly, you come in contact with enemy, do a little battle pose, screen blacks out for 2 seconds, and THEN the battle begins.
i don't wanna sound like a cry baby, but shit i'm sorry, i thought it would've..... lived up to what i read about..? not saying it doesn't look fun though. i'm extremely happy that everything happens at a really fast pace. i can't stand long battle transitions, it's a waste of my life (Lost Odyssey..). oh, and i'm also happy that the actual battle itself moves at that speed. much faster than i thought it would be.

2. who the hell was expecting an over the shoulder view?! what game is this?! resident evil 4/5? gears of war?! don't have a problem with it, but what was the problem with FF12's view where it was right behind the character? did they just wanna tweak it from FF12?

3. during the first boss battle with the shark-like robot, every time it would shoot its large beam, the characters would automatically go through their "i'm taking damage" animations. problem is, since the beam lasted so long, the character animations would repeat itself really quickly, over and over again. looked like the game was glitching, but this problem might just be a demo thing. i HOPE it's not like this in the final version.
(there were a couple of flops in Snow's boss battle too.)

4. if there's one thing that i know i shouldn't complain about (but will anyway), is the short cutscenes that happen before an important battle. some of the enemies will do a really flashy move before entering battle, like heading towards you at 100mph and then.... its like,
- STOP!! FREEZE FRAME!!!
- ok, now black the screen out...
- good, now bring the screen back!
- awesome, now everyone looks like they're on a chess board. good guys on one side, bad guys on the other. perfect!

^no, not perfect. sorry, i know its classic rpg status to do that, but when it happens, it ruins the impact of the cutscene before it =/

i know i'm bitching, but yea.... all i can say is that some of these parts disappointed me. i enjoyed 85%(?) of the demo, but i'm hoping that they change/fix some of this stuff for the better before it gets released later this year.

oh! and there's one thing about this demo that i'm curious about.
when the giant aircraft sent a rocket towards the bridge during Snow's segment, lots a people fell to their deaths. at least, that's what we should assume right? has ANY FF game ever showed so many people dieing like that ?_?
i mean.. it happened and i was like, "damn, that's harsh. i feel sad for those people".
(^that's probably why it was done that way too.. to make you feel sad.)

[Zeromous99]

The only thing i have to say is reserve decisons till final version bc demo is from what last year i bet some of the things you dislike will be taken out tweaked or replaced by the time the final version is done .

[doeman]

something tells me that the "2 second blackout before battle" won't be changed in the final release :(
i can feel it NOT happening...

[Xion]

its a seamless transition.

[doeman]

its a seamless transition.
yea, i figured someone would emphasize that part. how can a transition be seamless anyway? a transition has to stop doing one thing, and then do something else right?
isn't it just a really fast transition? whereas "seamless" means you don't even notice it?

[Thunder]

for point 2, you have free camera movement yaknow :aldo:

[doeman]

for point 2, you have free camera movement yaknow :aldo:
lol, i know, but if you try and center it behind your character, it looks "over the shoulder". compare that to FF12, kingdom hearts, or even zelda! not saying its bad though, i kinda like it.

[Astrozombie]

So basically you wrote that bigass paragraph about 2% of the demo?

The camera is only over the shoulder when it gets really close. Normally, it's zoomed out like a normal third person game. Or did you not watch the demo like you say you did? It's better that way so when you zoom in close, you see more than just the back of her head.

Example being here: YouTube - First 40 Minutes of the Final Fantasy XIII Demo (Part 2) HD

Also, while seamless transitions would be nice, you're really gonna complain about an approxomate 1.5 seconds? Seriously?

As for your 3d point, I suppose you're right, but that's really, really just nitpicking. It's a game, not real life. I didn't even notice it and I doubt many others did.

And for your 4th point, I agree. A longer cinema would be a lot less "lame". But I think for a mini-boss battle like that, there's not much cinema required. It's been like that in my FFs.

One thing I would like though, is a more subtle running/stopping animation. It's okay for a battle area, but if she does that in the city, it'd be very "wtf are you doing"ish.

[Xion]

yea, i figured someone would emphasize that part. how can a transition be seamless anyway? a transition has to stop doing one thing, and then do something else right?
isn't it just a really fast transition? whereas "seamless" means you don't even notice it?

seamless transition means it goes from one thing directly to another with nothing in between (in this case loading) ... in the case of over world -to- combat in the demo, seamless transition is an accurate description

[doeman]

damn, for someone who agrees with me for the most part, you show a little too much attitude. I'd respond in more detail now, but at work on the iPhone.

[RonTheDawn]

oh! and there's one thing about this demo that i'm curious about.
when the giant aircraft sent a rocket towards the bridge during Snow's segment, lots a people fell to their deaths. at least, that's what we should assume right? has ANY FF game ever showed so many people dieing like that ?_?
i mean.. it happened and i was like, "damn, that's harsh. i feel sad for those people".
(^that's probably why it was done that way too.. to make you feel sad.)[/quote]

Actually there was a couple seens in FFX were a large quantity of people died. Towards the beginning when Sin destroys Killika and later duringt Operation Mihen when most of the chocobo knights are killed.

In my opinion it really added substance to the plot. You really saw the effects seeing so many people die had on Tidus who unlike the rest of the party was not really used to seeing people die at all let alone on a large scale.

I think having one really important character die or a large amount of insignificant ones is a really good plot technique. FFXIII should have a strong narrative.

[doeman]

seamless transition means it goes from one thing directly to another with nothing in between (in this case loading) ... in the case of over world -to- combat in the demo, seamless transition is an accurate description
compare FF13's battle transitions to FF12.
FF12 is seamless.

[Astrozombie]

I only half agree with you on two of the points.

Just saying that your two biggest points aren't really that much to think about.

Also, you know how many options are always in the config menu. Maybe you'll be able to adjust the camera to how you want.

And please don't compare this game to FF12. FF12 was an MMO, without multiplayer.

[The_Steve]

If i'm gonna complain about anything, it's that I hate Sazh's constant dancing.
Man that's like early ps2 RPGs. Not even FFX was that bad, Tidus and Rikku
were the only overanimated characters during battle, and even then, it wasn't
that bad.

[Xion]

Im pretty direct and straight to the point. You could say the way i say things with an attitude, but im not throwing an attitude at you, im simply being direct in how i say what im sayin', get what im sayin' lol

but no your right, seamless transition would mean you dont notice it.

@ doeman- thats not an accurate comparison. In FF12, combat takes place in the overworld. so technically speaking, there is no overworld -to- combat transition short of a menu appearing.

[elektr1k]

I agree with point #2, the camera shit is wonky and awkward for me.

The rest of your points... crying, imo.

[Darkangel-XI]

I can't believe they have a battle transition either D:

I was hoping it would be like Chrono Trigger

[doeman]

Im pretty direct and straight to the point. You could say the way i say things with an attitude, but im not throwing an attitude at you, im simply being direct in how i say what im sayin', get what im sayin' lol

but no your right, seamless transition would mean you dont notice it.

@ doeman- thats not an accurate comparison. In FF12, combat takes place in the overworld. so technically speaking, there is no overworld -to- combat transition short of a menu appearing.
i wasn't directing that comment about attitude towards you. it was for astrozombie. at the time i was responding on the iphone. a bit slower.
and i see what ur saying about the overworld to combat transitions. like i said before, i don't have a problem is with the way it is now, but i'd prefer it if it were like FF12. FF12 has spoiled me with its incredibly fast battles. i love it.

[Sundance Kid]

I agree with you honestly about the disappointment of the battle system/demo, but at the same time I'm not really disappointed. I'm not crying or whining either cuz I stop caring about this game a long time ago. If SE plans on keeping it secretive and hyping it up and they give you a wonky battle system/cameras then no thanks SE. If someone wants to give me flack for not liking what I saw then go right ahead. I also liked FF12's battle (yeah I know I'm gonna hear it).

[doeman]

I agree with you honestly about the disappointment of the battle system/demo, but at the same time I'm not really disappointed. I'm not crying or whining either cuz I stop caring about this game a long time ago. If SE plans on keeping it secretive and hyping it up and they give you a wonky battle system/cameras then no thanks SE. If someone wants to give me flack for not liking what I saw then go right ahead. I also liked FF12's battle (yeah I know I'm gonna hear it).

well, ur not gonna "hear it" from me. i LOVE 12. and why are you lying to urself? you know you still love 13 :lol:

[Shiranui Reborn]

just remember this IS only a demo
and i thought i read somewhere that the demo isn't up to date with the current set up of the game --- duh lolz

and i agree with the shit transitions id prefer for them to be like xii as well
and thats cool that you work on the iPhone

[Xion]

i wasn't directing that comment about attitude towards you. it was for astrozombie. at the time i was responding on the iphone

I see, my mistake.

[doeman]

just remember this IS only a demo
and i thought i read somewhere that the demo isn't up to date with the current set up of the game --- duh lolz

and i agree with the shit transitions id prefer for them to be like xii as well
and thats cool that you work on the iPhone
yea, i've got high hopes that most of the kinks i've complained about will be fixed, but as i said before, the one thing that's most likely going to stay is the 2 second transition. and just in case someone else wants to argue with me again, i don't have a problem with that, i'd just rather have it like 12. I REPEAT, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH 13'S BATTLE TRANSITIONS, I'D JUST RATHER HAVE IT LIKE 12...

btw, i don't work on the iphone lol. i was AT work, on the iphone (slacking off) :P

[Sundance Kid]

well, ur not gonna "hear it" from me. i LOVE 12. and why are you lying to urself? you know you still love 13 :lol:
Not necessarily. FF series isnt my favorite RPG franchise. I've only really liked FF6, FF12, and Tactics. I only like FFXIII (for the most part) cuz of Lightning honestly.

:cookie:

[doeman]

Not necessarily. FF series isnt my favorite RPG franchise. I've only really liked FF6, FF12, and Tactics. I only like FFXIII (for the most part) cuz of Lightning honestly.

:cookie:
Lightning?? she's cool and all, but why is *that* your main reason for liking the game? you got a thing for her?

[Sundance Kid]

Lightning?? she's cool and all, but why is *that* your main reason for liking the game? you got a thing for her?
No I dont have a "thing" for her. I like her character so far and I said "for the most part" not the ENTIRE reason.

[doeman]

No I dont have a "thing" for her. I like her character so far and I said "for the most part" not the ENTIRE reason.
ok ok >_< i was only joking

[Xion]

yea, i've got high hopes that most of the kinks i've complained about will be fixed, but as i said before, the one thing that's most likely going to stay is the 2 second transition. and just in case someone else wants to argue with me again, i don't have a problem with that, i'd just rather have it like 12. I REPEAT, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH 13'S BATTLE TRANSITIONS, I'D JUST RATHER HAVE IT LIKE 12...

btw, i don't work on the iphone lol. i was AT work, on the iphone (slacking off) :P

I can tell you that isn't going to change. The reason behind it is by transitioning into a separate battle screen, they loosen up memory so they can use for added effects in battle. But It doesn't bother you so hey, it wont be a problem.

[doeman]

I can tell you that isn't going to change. The reason behind it is by transitioning into a separate battle screen, they loosen up memory so they can use for added effects in battle. But It doesn't bother you so hey, it wont be a problem.
oh snap, i've never thought of it that way.

"But It doesn't bother you so hey, it wont be a problem."
^ya know, i've played allot of rpgs, but i rarely have major problems with any of them. the only rpg i can recall right now that i've had problems with playing is Lost Odyssey. that game is a whole other story... i actually have a good rant about it on another website and i'd be happy to show you it ;)
unless you either don't care or haven't played the game. if its the latter, then i WON'T show it to you. its best to stay away from anything related to that depressing piece of crap.

[Xion]

oh snap, i've never thought of it that way.

"But It doesn't bother you so hey, it wont be a problem."
^ya know, i've played allot of rpgs, but i rarely have major problems with any of them. the only rpg i can recall right now that i've had problems with playing is Lost Odyssey. that game is a whole other story... i actually have a good rant about it on another website and i'd be happy to show you it ;)
unless you either don't care or haven't played the game. if its the latter, then i WON'T show it to you. its best to stay away from anything related to that depressing piece of crap.


I LOVE Lost Odyssey so please, DO NOT show me lol :lol:

[Shiranui Reborn]

btw, i don't work on the iphone lol. i was AT work, on the iphone (slacking off) :P

FFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUU-
now i feel dumb

i really gotta get me a Touch though

[doeman]

@ xion - oh god. WHY?!? please, tell me. i want to hear something good about that game.

@ shiranui - iphone/touch rule. i definitely don't regret buying mine.

[Xion]

I rather not. You obviously played the game yourself, so i cant argue against your opinion. I sure as hell hate when people argue against mine to so I wouldn't do that to you.

[doeman]

I rather not. You obviously played the game yourself, so i cant argue against your opinion. I sure as hell hate when people argue against mine to so I wouldn't do that to you.
aw... where's the fun in that?.. in any case, i never completed the game. i stopped after the first disc for... some... reason... that i can't recall right now ?_? but i intended to get back to it sooner or later. sadly, that never happened and i got caught up in other games. i'll briefly tell you why my experience with it was more negative than positive though. its been quite a while since my time playing the game, but here's what i remember.

1. 16 second load times before each battle? what a joke. i don't have a problem spending lots of time on a game, but that is definitely the WRONG way to do it. shiet.. as if the battles weren't long enough themselves.

2. too much story that i never cared about. i remember there used to be these "dream sequences" that happened at certain points in the game that told back story on Kaien or w/e his name is. it's a good amount of reading for each story, but after the 5th one, i just said, "ef it".

3. the battle system.. oh no the battle system. broken? or too old school? i'm tired of arguing about that aspect of the game.

[Xion]

ok well how about you install the disc, because that cuts the loading down alot, and maybe at least finish it. Its a very old school game, very old school. Its def not broken, there is really nothing wrong with it..its just, old school as can be.

[doeman]

ok well how about you install the disc, because that cuts the loading down alot, and maybe at least finish it. Its a very old school game, very old school. Its def not broken, there is really nothing wrong with it..its just, old school as can be.
hey hey hey now, when i said, "its been quite a while", i meant its been about a year since i've played it. trust me, ever since the day of the NXE, i've installed all of my games on the 360 before playing them. only a nub wouldn't.

ya know what the problem is? its too old school for me, so it *feels* broken. oh well, just another game on my "don't care to finish" list. that's 4 rpgs so far.
1. FFX-2
2. Lost Odyssey
3. FFXII Revenant Wings
4. Tales of Legendia

[Sundance Kid]

ok ok >_< i was only joking
Yeah you better be I'll cut you >:{

[Wandering Hands]

Kennabear, I'd do you over Lightning any day. <3

[Sundance Kid]

Kennabear, I'd do you over Lightning any day. <3
oh Shuyu
:wub:

You make life worth living

[Wandering Hands]

And to think people say I'm mean...

[Sundance Kid]

And to think people say I'm mean...
You are....but in a good way of course. You don't see me complaining

:cunning:

[1nOnly]

EDIT: excuse the bad spelling, was writing kinda fast

I just watched the HD versions last night and i must say the game did a better job than i thought. This is my overall opinion about it:

1. the gfx didnt look as crappy as i've seen before (or was it because i was half asleep? lol) i'm gonna have to take another look at it.

2. Lightings battle pose, WTF is that all about? it looks like she want her boobs to be reconized or something. and Sazh's dancin around like monkey. It seems like they are trying to create the illusion that its an action game and it fails greatly sometimes (like when Lightning and Sazh is moving around and when they come near each other, they change the direction in a weird way)

3. The battle system looks fun, but i wonder how the camera will do when you are controlling all the 3 characters in the party.. because from what i saw the camera is concetrated on Lightning most (if not only) on Lightning. And i think that Lightning jumps around way to much, almost every attack she does involves jumpin. I love the effects but its really a litle too much, like when Snows punches hit the enemy. And i'm actually very impressed of the fast battle transition!!

4. After seing Nora in action i must say that the firehair-guy (dont remember his name) made a better impression on me, and the kid and slut just didnt impress much. the slut should seriously just get a change of design (i think that thats one thing we wont be seing in Versus)

If they can only tweak the gfx a little more (LIGHTNINGS HAIR!!!!!!), crank down the jumpy movements of Lightning and monkey dance of Sazh and get rid of the Nora-slut (i know they wont but they should,imo) I would be pleased.. And one thing i'm very dissapointed with the Demo is that they didnt show us anything BRIGHT, i really thought that we would be seing Pulse and Cocoon and not just one of them. It gave the whole game a feeling that its only sci-fi-ish. but its always better than nothing
I also think though that they should have had more content in the demo because that shit was expensive (not that i bought it or anything)

[cheesepizza]

I feel the same for Point 1... (the transitions are quite smart though.... even though THERE IS A TRANSITION RAWR) and this relates to Point 3: God it just didn't flow very well, like when the final boss guy for Lightning and Sazh (looked like a judge from FFXIII) was like "TOO LATE! *100kph flight into Lightnings face* then TRANSITION (omG) and he's just "lol k let's start this thing :D you go first".... yea <_<

And for the Damage animation, I thought we were over the spasms DX can't they just have 1 prolonged "ARGH" thing for damage? Rather than "ARGH-ARGH-ARGH-ARGH-ARGH-ARGH" <_<

The battles appear to be on the same field but I hoped they would add in the little details, like when Snow and them went up to the last round of soldiers who had the prisoners behind them, the battle screen didn't have the prisoners where they should be.... that's probably me picking away at the little things but yea...

O and hi to everyone ._.

EDIT: Yes and I thought Lightning jumped and twirled too much.... looked like she puts more energy into jumping and spinning than into the actual attacks. But then again if you slomo it it doesn't look too over the top, you could always argue that the spinning is just adding more force to the attack or the result of the strong attack........... you could <_<
And Sazh's dancing is lolmaterial XD They should keep it hehe
Anyone else notice the shadows on the character models going crazy at times? Needs tweaking....

[doeman]

@ 1nOnly
2. what battle pose are you talking about? when she comes within range of an enemy and then slightly crouches down? isn't that a technique used to be stealthy? not sure if it really helps, it might be just for looks, and i didn't have a problem with her looking like she "wants her boobs to be reconized or something". you can't even see them in the first place because of what she's wearing.

3. when the times comes to switch between different allies during battle, focusing the camera on other characters shouldn't be hard at all. dunno why you think that'd be a problem. as for Lightning's jump-happy mood, i never really had a problem with it until you picked it out. i checked out some of her battles just now, and its true, she does jump a little too much. looks flashy, but it's almost kinda silly stupid at times. the ONE part where i don't mind her jumping, is after she finishes her attacks. that's when she backflips out of the enemies reach. other than that, i could careless if the rest changed in the final version. Sahz's dancing is something i got used to after the 2nd fight. its amusing to see him dance. and i kinda feel the same way about how the characters shift their movements on the battle field. its looks "OK", but sometimes it looks like the characters are braindead and their just walking into each other. this problem might just be a demo thing hopefully.

4. i didn't mind the fire-haired guy either. the kid posed useless because he wasn't even in battle and the other girl was kinda annoying. just another "hot female character" who likes to talk and probably isn't strong enough to back up whatever she says by herself. phail.
one of the things that bothered me about Nora's segment was that you apparently had 4 people to choose from for battle right? if the kid was also able to fight, why didn't the player enter the menu or something and select him? i would've liked to see that... unless there was no menu you could access in the demo...

- what's wrong with Lightning's hair? you want it to move and flow in and out of battle? i think her little cape was substituted for that purpose instead. i lke it that way.
now........ i do agree with you that the price to pay for this demo might've been a little expensive, i guess, but how long did you really want the DEMO to be? i think it was fine, i wouldn't want SE giving out too much content for us.

@ cheesepizza
i'm glad we see eye-to-eye on these things, and i agree with you about the part with the prisoners.

[Astrozombie]

3. The battle system looks fun, but i wonder how the camera will do when you are controlling all the 3 characters in the party.. because from what i saw the camera is concetrated on Lightning most (if not only) on Lightning.

Pretty sure you only control Lightning.

Or one character, depending on who you're playing as.

[Daemon]

Previously, the camera sometimes focused on the character attacking. Since you can switch between characters, it'll probably be like XII and have the camera follow that one.

[Astrozombie]

Can you show me where the camera switched? That'd be good news to me.

[doeman]

so is there some sort of gambit system like in 12 that controls your allies?

[Daemon]

Can you show me where the camera switched? That'd be good news to me.

Not in the demo, as you can only control Lightning and Snow there, but it has been said that players will be free to change characters in the final version.

so is there some sort of gambit system like in 12 that controls your allies?

I have no idea whether all 3 members of a party will be fully controllable or if they'll have AI. Currently in the demo they have an AI that works to complement your actions or something like that, but I don't know if that's just because of the way the demo was implemented or not.

[doeman]

well.. i really hope there's some sort of gambit system like in 12. it really helps when you can indirectly control specific actions on your allies.

[cheesepizza]

Well it sounds like the "gambit system" is sort of integrated into battles already, how they said that the players actions will influence the actions of the other party members and such, while you are not controlling them :O So maybe basically the actions that you take ARE the "gambits"heh... if that makes any sense....... OMG THEY SHOULD JUST RELEASE INFO

[doeman]

Well it sounds like the "gambit system" is sort of integrated into battles already, how they said that the players actions will influence the actions of the other party members and such, while you are not controlling them :O So maybe basically the actions that you take ARE the "gambits"heh... if that makes any sense....... OMG THEY SHOULD JUST RELEASE INFO
that'd be a strange way for your allies to function :blink:. and i say "strange" because in a way it would work, but then again, lets say you do one thing and you'd like the computer to do another thing. it might end up doing something totally different.. so its not... really.. that reliable.. or that's what i'm assuming.

i read somewhere that at this E3, SE was gonna reveal allot more info about 13. hopefully they'll say something about the 360 version. i'm a bit curious about how many discs that one will need. (fyi - i'm NOT getting it for the 360. ps3 all the way)

[Daemon]

that'd be a strange way for your allies to function :blink:. and i say "strange" because in a way it would work, but then again, lets say you do one thing and you'd like the computer to do another thing. it might end up doing something totally different.. so its not... really.. that reliable.. or that's what i'm assuming.

i read somewhere that at this E3, SE was gonna reveal allot more info about 13. hopefully they'll say something about the 360 version. i'm a bit curious about how many discs that one will need. (fyi - i'm NOT getting it for the 360. ps3 all the way)

yes that would be strange. personally i'd prefer full control of all chars (i never used gambits in XII), unless the fast pace of 13 makes that impossible.

about E3: well this is the year that they want ' the whole world to know about ffxiii', isn't it? When is/are htis year's convention(s) anyway? E3/JF/TGS wtc

[doeman]

yes that would be strange. personally i'd prefer full control of all chars (i never used gambits in XII), unless the fast pace of 13 makes that impossible.

about E3: well this is the year that they want ' the whole world to know about ffxiii', isn't it? When is/are htis year's convention(s) anyway? E3/JF/TGS wtc
June 2-4
http://www.e3expo.com/

you "didn't" use the gambits in 12? how? that's impossible. did you change the original battle system settings from "Active" to "Wait", so you'd have time to set each characters actions? or did you lower the gameplay speed so that you could keep up with the battle?
what's wrong with the gambits anyway =/

[Zezlar]

People bitch that the Final Fantasy games need to be different. Then they bitch that they don't ever want another game like XII (Which was GOOD) and now the new thing is that it's not like XII. MY GOD FFS! People always got to bitch about SOMETHING.

That's enough venting for me. Sleep time ^^

[Daemon]

Yeah, that's what I did - wait mode. I always use wait mode 'cause I feel it gives room to breath. Maybe that's why I liked 10.
Like i said, I prefer more control. There's nothing wrong with gambits, I just didn't use them. I enjoyed XII and don't understand the bashing it gets for its MMORPG-ness, 'cause I like those.

13 is looking a bit like a combo of both with X-2 thrown in, so I'm thinking i will like it.

[1nOnly]

@ 1nOnly
2. what battle pose are you talking about?
I'm talking about when she's standing still like a typical hero with the chest out in the air. i think it was a litle too much but its nothing big

3. when the times comes to switch between different allies during battle, focusing the camera on other characters shouldn't be hard at all. dunno why you think that'd be a problem.
Well i think that its going to be a problem because you will not have the dynamic cameras for every member in your party, in the demo the camera is/was focused on Lightning or Snow, and by that you missed what the others were doing from time to time.. and since its no actuall realtime battle like in FFXII i was just hoping for more dynamic camera movements.



- what's wrong with Lightning's hair? you want it to move and flow in and out of battle? i think her little cape was substituted for that purpose instead. i lke it that way.
now........ i do agree with you that the price to pay for this demo might've been a little expensive, i guess, but how long did you really want the DEMO to be? i think it was fine, i wouldn't want SE giving out too much content for us.

If you look close (not that you have to) you'll notice that Lightnings hair is stiff and not as fluent as you'd expect, from the front its kinda okay but from the back and the left side (i think] its stiff like a d*** (lol) and its not that they dont know how to model her head and hair so that it moves when she moves a litle, instead it looks like plain texture thats suposed to look like hair. i'd be fine if she only was an npc but she's main character..

I dont think that they gave away much or even anything at all (story wise), a demo is suposed to a give a taste of the full game, and an RPG like a FF-game is always BIG but they only gave people a taste of a dark place in cocoon with nothing to do (beside the battle) .. I understand if they only wanted the players to get taste of the battlesystem but i'm just a litle dissapointed, i wanted to see more of both sides (cocoon and pulse)

[cheesepizza]

@1nOnly
Her pose looked weird but didn't look like she was actually sticking her chest out.... it's either that or slouching... or humped over like Gadot (lmfao wtf is up with his pose).
As for her hair, I agree. It looks alright from the front... but from the back it was like... what plastered to the side of her neck?

Well I guess we can assume from Vanille's square fingers (and a lot of other squares) that this is the pre-glossed version of the graphics. Hoping for more refinement in the full release.

And what's wrong with XII's battle system... Fast paced game like XIII should have something like XII but maybe without so much freedom and more flashy stuff (achieved... may be over- too). You can't move your character freely during battle in XIII right?
(You can't hide behind rocks and stuff and dodge attacks (lol eg. the hunt for the Wyrm in the Westersand in XII... Rocks FTW)? Or separate party members so AoE attacks don't down your whole party (Lightning and Sazh were begging to be zapped by the beam in the demo I saw...standing in a line like that)?)

[doeman]

@ 1nOnly - ok, i see what you were talking about now regarding her "battle pose". you mean the stance she takes while *in battle*. hey, if that bothers you, i guess i can't argue with it, but honestly, i didn't even notice it until you mentioned that. it's a slight curve, who cares!

- about the camera........ lets say its possible to control other characters in battle. my guess is that, once you switch characters, the camera will go with you. the "other" allies will always be the background focus of the camera. this is just my assumption though.

- like i said, i believe the cape was substituted in place of her hair for the appendage on Lightning's body that would have a "flowing movement". trust me, i noticed her hair looked like it was glued to her skull, but my reason to believe its like that, is because in past games, "flowing hair" tends to get a little too wild and often look unrealistic. sometimes it will even flow through the characters body during an in-game cutscene. i myself have witnessed this many times. maybe SE doesn't want that happening in 13? maybe the ps3 can't control that level of "flowing movement" as precisely as they want it to as of yet?
i'd be fine if she only was an npc but she's main character.. this is why i hate the internet. people are allowed to have their own opinions. i would NEVER degrade Lightning to a npc.
a demo is supposed to a give a taste of the full game LoL. dunno where you got that from. i've never played a demo that's given me the full taste of the game.

@ cheesepizza - the fact that you can't freely move around like in 12 greatly disappoints me. there were plenty of times when i could have an enemy just facing ONE character while the other two attack from behind. with 13, everyone's in sight of the enemy. HOPEFULLY, there will be some sort of skill/technique similar to "Lure" from 12, so that you can direct all enemy attacks to one character that you choose to be the tank. that's the only way i see around the disadvantage of being unable to move certain characters whereever you want.

[cheesepizza]

@doeman
I would be happy if you can just move freely in battle =_= and I thought there was going to be some form of "dodge" control?
And is it that hard to have the player control the characters position in the battle map? Or would that kill the battle cinematics <_<

[doeman]

i think having a "dodge" button would make this an "action rpg". looks like we're gonna have to rely mostly on Evasion stats. and i don't think controlling the character's movements on the map would "kill the battle cinematics", it's just that the genre of the game would change to either "action rpg" or "strategic rpg".
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hmmm...... now that i think about it, that's an interesting concept. let say the control layout, the looks, the camera angles, and everything else in the game remained unchanged. you wanna move your character left and right on the battle field? use the left analog stick, and to select attacks, use the directional pad. seems kinda simple, but then again, only being able to stay planted on the floor while moving left and right is kinda... "lame"? i'd like to be able to jump and all that, but her attacks have so much jumping involved already and.......
damn, w/e, i just don't see that theory working. if they wanted to give us complete control of Lightning, it'd be an action rpg game.

just wait for FFV13.

[Daemon]

There used to be a 'guard/defend' option in some of the older games, i think when you skipped a turn. Do you think that's possible here? Or could it work as a technique, like attack, or would that be too difficult.
On a side note, does anyone know / have an idea/theory about escaping battles and how that is/will be implemented?

[cheesepizza]

Yea... What I mean is... the actions (Lightnings jumping and flipping) could screw up if you can move freely on the field........ what am I saying O_O I want free movement D:

And yes the "dodge" command would make it action RPG but I thought I read it somewhere before D: Wonder if it was also just speculation or actual word of god ._.. Well we all know there should be such thing as "miss" lol XD Well there could always be the option of using your entire ATB to dodge an attack (only the character you are controlling but that would be weird... I guess there could be the option of doing it for all members as long as their ATB is full? O_-) or something along those lines....

OOO and status ailments :D I hope they actually make the characters look confused (lol) or blinded or poisoned etc when they are confused (lol XD) or blinded or poisoned etc (o and recovery of course.. a good eye rub for given eye drops etc)
GG there ARE going to be status ailments right? Saw no hint in demo but then again it's a demo and this IS FF....

@Daemon
Imagine the treadmilling-escape in this LOL. As for escape, if they say the battles are hard maybe there won't even be escapes O_O ... You could always have an escape option that charges separately.. and you can only use it after a certain amount of time or something like that.............. any maybe restrict the use to only vertain party members or w/e......... heh

[1nOnly]

@ 1nOnly - ok, i see what you were talking about now regarding her "battle pose". you mean the stance she takes while *in battle*. hey, if that bothers you, i guess i can't argue with it, but honestly, i didn't even notice it until you mentioned that. it's a slight curve, who cares!

- about the camera........ lets say its possible to control other characters in battle. my guess is that, once you switch characters, the camera will go with you. the "other" allies will always be the background focus of the camera. this is just my assumption though.

- like i said, i believe the cape was substituted in place of her hair for the appendage on Lightning's body that would have a "flowing movement". trust me, i noticed her hair looked like it was glued to her skull, but my reason to believe its like that, is because in past games, "flowing hair" tends to get a little too wild and often look unrealistic. sometimes it will even flow through the characters body during an in-game cutscene. i myself have witnessed this many times. maybe SE doesn't want that happening in 13? maybe the ps3 can't control that level of "flowing movement" as precisely as they want it to as of yet?

well i can say that even in TLR the hair of the characters was "flowing", imo it was not the best hair modeling i've seen but it at least didnt look like plastic.. even Versus have more flow in the hair and its on the same engine.. the hair thing is just one of many technical let-down's in FFXIII, visually it just aint a Great game.... and i dont think that they will do something about it, i'm just gonna have to get used to it i guess..

LoL. dunno where you got that from. i've never played a demo that's given me the full taste of the game.

well i dont know what kind of demos you've played but practicly all the demos i've played has given me a full taste of a game (exept for TLR demo for PC)
and by full taste i didnt mean that they would show us every boss or every gameplay aspects, all i ment was just for an RPG what they put in the demo was way weak, i never even got the feeling that i wanted to play the game myself when watching the videos. i got excited a litle but nothing more.
I would have like for them to show us maybe a town, a sumon or maybe just some other environment.. or maybe you think thats giving away to much of a game thats probably gonna last for 60h+

[doomed_soul89]

i think having a "dodge" button would make this an "action rpg". looks like we're gonna have to rely mostly on Evasion stats. and i don't think controlling the character's movements on the map would "kill the battle cinematics", it's just that the genre of the game would change to either "action rpg" or "strategic rpg".
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hmmm...... now that i think about it, that's an interesting concept. let say the control layout, the looks, the camera angles, and everything else in the game remained unchanged. you wanna move your character left and right on the battle field? use the left analog stick, and to select attacks, use the directional pad. seems kinda simple, but then again, only being able to stay planted on the floor while moving left and right is kinda... "lame"? i'd like to be able to jump and all that, but her attacks have so much jumping involved already and.......
damn, w/e, i just don't see that theory working. if they wanted to give us complete control of Lightning, it'd be an action rpg game.

just wait for FFV13.
the only game that has ever successfully mixed action and turn based rpg is Mario rpg for the n64, it's sad really, it had platforming stuff with mario but turn based rpg stat's and fighting and you could increase/decrease the amount of damage you did/took with well timed button presses, I think that would be the best way to add action rpg elements to it, platforming and timed button presses, non of this AI and gambit crap they been pulling lately, as for controling your character movement on the map, if they were going to do this they should inscrease the action points to a much larger number (dozens-hundreds) and moving takes a small amount and stuff like magic and attacks take a large amount, it's been done before in many games and could be done again so easily, would be better then them just randomly moving around in my opinion

as for the seamless thing, it is not seamless, the boss battles in FFX were more seamless then this one, so yea

the a ton of ppl dieing thing has been done in a ton of FF games, or did you forget you blew up a maco reactor (equal to a nuclear one atleast) in FFVII or that the gardens got blown up in FFVIII, or the world scattered in FFVI, and there the sin stuff in FFX, it's just in most of the previous ones the graphics were too poor to really notice or care and they never really shown anyone die directly in the scenes

[SORA HEART]

bullshit

hh u don't even know what the good sid of the demo .. any way its ur opinion & im respect it ..

but its bullshit .

[doeman]

@ daemon - up until now, i haven't put any thought into how the "escape" option would work during battle. it'd seem kinda flakey to have the treadmill affect like cheesepizza said, so maybe if you want to escape, you press the button and that's it. or maybe it's based on a "chance of escaping percentage"? and what would happen to the enemies on the world map if YOU DID escape? would they be there still?

@ cheesepizza - being that this is the next gen ff game, i hope they go all out with the little things. if someone gets blinded, have them cover their eyes and start rubbing them in between attacks. however, being cured is a different story. lets say you want to heal yourself from blindness with the item "eye drops". the "next gen" thing to do is have the character whip out some eye drops and quickly use them right? that'd be cool to see.
BUT... what if you want another character to heal the affected one? will the ally toss the character the eye drops so they can use it? will the ally run over to the character and pour it in their eyes? dunno how thats gonna work =/

@ 1nOnly - "the hair thing is just one of many technical let-down's in FFXIII, visually it just aint a Great game"
i'm sure you typed that up knowing that all of the visuals we've seen so far are coming from an uncompleted product. but that aside, ur right about the part where ffv13 is using the same engine. so why do the hair physics look so much better there than in ff13? beats me. maybe, just MAYBE Lightning's hair is so stiff because she's a soldier? something that she doesn't want getting in her way? old army habits? or maybe they just don't want her hair getting in the way of the cape? if so, why didn't they just make her hair shorter? idk, maybe they really wanted a female protagonist with long hair, but because of the cape, they programed it so her hair would never get in the capes way?

@ doomed - several of the mario rpgs have "rpg" mixed with "action".
-super mario rpg
-paper mario series
-mario and luigi series
i think that having a little bit of action is always a plus. there are games like ff10 which only allowed extra button commands when you did a limit break right? but ff10-2 allowed you to go "trigger happy" with a gun classed warrior. the mario rpg's had you timing your attacks for extra damage (as you said), and that could also be done in Lost Odyssey.
maybe SE has a trick up their sleeve to replace all of the extra button mashing/timed attacks? maybe there WILL be a "trigger happy" mode, but it needs specific requirements to use? and don't forget about that "V-Strike" command and "Overclock" mode or w/e its called.

[Zezlar]

@ daemon - up until now, i haven't put any thought into how the "escape" option would work during battle. it'd seem kinda flakey to have the treadmill affect like cheesepizza said, so maybe if you want to escape, you press the button and that's it. or maybe it's based on a "chance of escaping percentage"? and what would happen to the enemies on the world map if YOU DID escape? would they be there still?

@ cheesepizza - being that this is the next gen ff game, i hope they go all out with the little things. if someone gets blinded, have them cover their eyes and start rubbing them in between attacks. however, being cured is a different story. lets say you want to heal yourself from blindness with the item "eye drops". the "next gen" thing to do is have the character whip out some eye drops and quickly use them right? that'd be cool to see.
BUT... what if you want another character to heal the affected one? will the ally toss the character the eye drops so they can use it? will the ally run over to the character and pour it in their eyes? dunno how thats gonna work =/

@ 1nOnly - "the hair thing is just one of many technical let-down's in FFXIII, visually it just aint a Great game"
i'm sure you typed that up knowing that all of the visuals we've seen so far are coming from an uncompleted product. but that aside, ur right about the part where ffv13 is using the same engine. so why do the hair physics look so much better there than in ff13? beats me. maybe, just MAYBE Lightning's hair is so stiff because she's a soldier? something that she doesn't want getting in her way? old army habits? or maybe they just don't want her hair getting in the way of the cape? if so, why didn't they just make her hair shorter? idk, maybe they really wanted a female protagonist with long hair, but because of the cape, they programed it so her hair would never get in the capes way?

@ doomed - several of the mario rpgs have "rpg" mixed with "action".
-super mario rpg
-paper mario series
-mario and luigi series
i think that having a little bit of action is always a plus. there are games like ff10 which only allowed extra button commands when you did a limit break right? but ff10-2 allowed you to go "trigger happy" with a gun classed warrior. the mario rpg's had you timing your attacks for extra damage (as you said), and that could also be done in Lost Odyssey.
maybe SE has a trick up their sleeve to replace all of the extra button mashing/timed attacks? maybe there WILL be a "trigger happy" mode, but it needs specific requirements to use? and don't forget about that "V-Strike" command and "Overclock" mode or w/e its called.

In Xenosaga games when you escaped, the monsters would still be on the screen, it gave you like 2-3 seconds to move and getaway from them.

[doeman]

In Xenosaga games when you escaped, the monsters would still be on the screen, it gave you like 2-3 seconds to move and getaway from them.
oh man... that's lame. i was hoping someone wouldn't say that. i pray that 13 doesn't work that way.

[Zezlar]

oh man... that's lame. i was hoping someone wouldn't say that. i pray that 13 doesn't work that way.

Suprisingly though, that escape system worked very well. Even if you were one of those people who tried to beat the game as low lvl as possible, the bosses would punish you.

[doeman]

Suprisingly though, that escape system worked very well. Even if you were one of those people who tried to beat the game as low lvl as possible, the bosses would punish you.
i'm definitely not one of those people who try to beat a game at a low level. i like my level grinding (granted that its not painful to do). reason why i don't like that format of escaping is because is seems too unrealistic. why would the enemy give you a 2-3 second head start to run away ?_?

[doomed_soul89]

@ daemon - up until now, i haven't put any thought into how the "escape" option would work during battle. it'd seem kinda flakey to have the treadmill affect like cheesepizza said, so maybe if you want to escape, you press the button and that's it. or maybe it's based on a "chance of escaping percentage"? and what would happen to the enemies on the world map if YOU DID escape? would they be there still?

@ cheesepizza - being that this is the next gen ff game, i hope they go all out with the little things. if someone gets blinded, have them cover their eyes and start rubbing them in between attacks. however, being cured is a different story. lets say you want to heal yourself from blindness with the item "eye drops". the "next gen" thing to do is have the character whip out some eye drops and quickly use them right? that'd be cool to see.
BUT... what if you want another character to heal the affected one? will the ally toss the character the eye drops so they can use it? will the ally run over to the character and pour it in their eyes? dunno how thats gonna work =/

@ 1nOnly - "the hair thing is just one of many technical let-down's in FFXIII, visually it just aint a Great game"
i'm sure you typed that up knowing that all of the visuals we've seen so far are coming from an uncompleted product. but that aside, ur right about the part where ffv13 is using the same engine. so why do the hair physics look so much better there than in ff13? beats me. maybe, just MAYBE Lightning's hair is so stiff because she's a soldier? something that she doesn't want getting in her way? old army habits? or maybe they just don't want her hair getting in the way of the cape? if so, why didn't they just make her hair shorter? idk, maybe they really wanted a female protagonist with long hair, but because of the cape, they programed it so her hair would never get in the capes way?

@ doomed - several of the mario rpgs have "rpg" mixed with "action".
-super mario rpg
-paper mario series
-mario and luigi series
i think that having a little bit of action is always a plus. there are games like ff10 which only allowed extra button commands when you did a limit break right? but ff10-2 allowed you to go "trigger happy" with a gun classed warrior. the mario rpg's had you timing your attacks for extra damage (as you said), and that could also be done in Lost Odyssey.
maybe SE has a trick up their sleeve to replace all of the extra button mashing/timed attacks? maybe there WILL be a "trigger happy" mode, but it needs specific requirements to use? and don't forget about that "V-Strike" command and "Overclock" mode or w/e its called.

true a lot have combined a few action elements, but super mario rpg was the only one that was a complete mix of platforming and rpg, you have no idea how long I'm wanted a more seriously one of that, I mean X-2 kinda tried but you just held circle down and watched yuna jump, if they put say, tomb raiders platforming with a FF rpg then that game would be so good, but it would need either random battles or the way super mario rpg did the battles other wise it would just end up like XII

[doeman]

true a lot have combined a few action elements, but super mario rpg was the only one that was a complete mix of platforming and rpg, you have no idea how long I'm wanted a more seriously one of that, I mean X-2 kinda tried but you just held circle down and watched yuna jump, if they put say, tomb raiders platforming with a FF rpg then that game would be so good, but it would need either random battles or the way super mario rpg did the battles other wise it would just end up like XII
lol, tomb raidor rpg. i won't be surprised if i see something like that actually happen now since SE's merge with Eidos.

[doomed_soul89]

lol, tomb raidor rpg. i won't be surprised if i see something like that actually happen now since SE's merge with Eidos.

Hey it would be good, the platforming would give you a break for the strategy stuff and grinding and allow for a much more interactive inviroment, and like have items hidden everywhere and you have to climb and jump to get them, maybe even add stuff like a rope and grappler thing or maybe even a a whole set of gear for platforming where most of it is optional

[doeman]

no matter how i look at it, it feels like that type of game would end up being called "action rpg". regular rpg's like ff13, DO have a limit =/

[cheesepizza]

^^ Well even so... there's this thing called "evolution". It doesn't really have to stick to its roots... a fast paced game like this (as they make it out to be) shouldn't have to live with full on immobolised turn based stuff... or just running around occasionally pressing x to examine something or open a chest... they could incorporate more action into the field but just not as much as ... something like a full on MMORPG would have... (well actually that would be awesome but think that would have to just build up slowly.. actually I would not wanna play this right now if it goes to full action mode ._.)

Waaah I'm spouting nonsense ;_;

Well anyway regarding the escape... hopefully there isn't coz as someone said above.. it's not relaly logical unless they chase you after you leave and just keep engaging you in battle which angers you forcing to to "have to kill them or RAWR" (LOL at treadmilling still... that would be so funny XD illogical but funny XD)

And yes the little things! It will die as a next gen game if the little things = ignored! Details DETAILS! I like the NPC speech thing.... the decrease distance = increase volume......... hmmmmmm no running againt walls =3= interacting with the wall however...

[doomed_soul89]

no matter how i look at it, it feels like that type of game would end up being called "action rpg". regular rpg's like ff13, DO have a limit =/
meh labels are pointless, I mean there are ppl calling Mirror's Edge a fps, it would just be like any turn based rpg accept it would have platforming in the field, I mean super mario rpg did it and it was called, well I don't really know, but it did it, it's just it was cartoony

[1nOnly]

bullshit

hh u don't even know what the good sid of the demo .. any way its ur opinion & im respect it ..

but its bullshit .

I didnt really get the part that was bullshit?


@ 1nOnly - "the hair thing is just one of many technical let-down's in FFXIII, visually it just aint a Great game"
i'm sure you typed that up knowing that all of the visuals we've seen so far are coming from an uncompleted product. but that aside, ur right about the part where ffv13 is using the same engine. so why do the hair physics look so much better there than in ff13? beats me. maybe, just MAYBE Lightning's hair is so stiff because she's a soldier? something that she doesn't want getting in her way? old army habits? or maybe they just don't want her hair getting in the way of the cape? if so, why didn't they just make her hair shorter? idk, maybe they really wanted a female protagonist with long hair, but because of the cape, they programed it so her hair would never get in the capes way?

.
I dont really think you understood my point of her hair being stiff, i'm talking about her hair not looking natural at all from the back, go and take a look at some screenshots and you'll understand what i mean

[doeman]

@ chessepizza - sounds like you just want a next gen version of ff12.
if there's one thing i wish every game had, it'd be voices for every single character in the game. the only games i've played to do that are Mass Effect and Fallout 3. regular people in the crowds, shop keepers, people out on the world map, everyone!

@ doomed - so, are you saying you want ff13 to be like the mario rpgs? platforming, timed attacks in battle, etc etc?

@ 1nOnly - no no! trust me, i know what ur talking about. the back of her hair looks like its been glued to her skull and looks really fake. i'm saying that it looks that way because her hair is being pulled to hang out in the front. when a person pulls their hair to the front like that, the hair on the back of their head will look like its' being strained right? maybe that's what SE is trying to express and are working on making it look more realistic?

[Hynad]

I think Lightning's hair look quite as good as those in Versus... when you see them in the "in-engine" cut-scene sequences (as in: not those using the gameplay graphics).

If you want to do a fair comparison between the look of FF XIII and Versus, you'll have to wait until we get any gameplay footage of the later. What we got so far for Versus has been CGI and this one "in-engine" cut-scene involving Stella and Noctis.

[doeman]

I think Lightning's hair look quite as good as those in Versus... when you see them in the "in-engine" cut-scene sequences (as in: not those using the gameplay graphics).

If you want to do a fair comparison between the look of FF XIII and Versus, you'll have to wait until we get any gameplay footage of the later. What we got so far for Versus has been CGI and this one "in-engine" cut-scene involving Stella and Noctis.
i feel like a moron for not taking that into consideration :|. completely slipped my mind.

there's a nice in-game cutscene after the 2nd battle with the shark robot. i'll be honest, her hair only looks a little bit better than the gameplay graphics. its still very stiff and i still say it's SE's intention to make it look so. however, it could use a little more work.

[Ikkin]

the hair thing is just one of many technical let-down's in FFXIII, visually it just aint a Great game....

:lol:

FFXIII is a 720p console game (automatically upscaled to 1080p to match the CG) with 4x anti-aliasing, according to Beyond3D. It's also got an awesome lighting engine and, apart from the hair, awesome character models.

Not sure what standard you're using to say that visually, it's not a great game.

[doeman]

i think the game looks friggen amazing :awesome:

[cheesepizza]

(Everyone flames XII D: I like it >.<)

On a related note... what happened to chocobo transport D: D: D: no more chocobo jingles DX?

As for Lightning's hair, Lightning = Cloud = Hair doesn't lose shape even after a good soaking in water :D :D That or she's had that style since her hair grew to be that long *coughcough*
Anyway Nomura should have taken this thing into consideration when he designed her... of course design shouldn't have to be restricted by hardware capabilities but yea... well Lebreaus hair fell from behind shoulder (kinda through the shoulder <_<) to in front of shoulder when she lent forward.. of course her hair is kinda short and straight so heh.... dunno what I'm getting at...

And the Versus cutscene... was good but the hair looked so plastic.. not in the rendering but in the... thickness and the way the hair is all... arranged soo... in line O_O unnatural... But it's still in development so meh...

And for both games, I don't like how the hair (Lightning and Stella) appears to hover over the shoulder you know?

[Astrozombie]

Get off it. "OMG THE HAIR ISN'T PHOTO REALISTIC! I MUST BICKER ABOUT THIS".

It's a videogame, and it's hair, and you're complaining about it. Wow.

[Devegas]

they have nothing better to do what do you expect?

[Zezlar]

I honstly don't care about her hair. IT IS A VIDEO GAME GET THE FUCK OVER IT. It's not real life, it's a VIDEO GAMMMMMMMEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jay_Z]

Really just don't stress out about it right now. Any complaints people have about the graphics will most likely be handled in the last couple of months, which is the time for polishing the game. 8 months until the game comes out, so bickering over the graphics just seems petty.

[doeman]

hey... 1nOnly is the ONLY person who was complaining about the hair. (i now see why he chose that username. suits him) i was just rollin with the conversation. i believe i've said that the graphics are "friggen amazing" :awesome:

@ cheesepizza - now i think YOU'RE going to deep into this "hair" thing. i mean honestly, the hair in both ff13 and ffv13 look fine, in-game engine or not.
i just watched some parts of the ffv13 trailer again and.... yea, i don't see a problem.

[Astrozombie]

Many people have complained about silly little things like that though. It's dumb as hell.

[cheesepizza]

@doeman
I can't help it D: the more I watch the more imperfections I see DX DX *slap me* But I have to say Stella's hovering hair is really annoying lol I will accept that Lightning just had a megaperm or something

[Lord Of Dumbasses]

Please shut the fuck up about the hair or I'll have to kill someone.

[Astrozombie]

Internet badass to the rescue.

He's gonna beat your ass with his badass Dante avatar.

[doeman]

@doeman
I can't help it D: the more I watch the more imperfections I see DX DX *slap me* But I have to say Stella's hovering hair is really annoying lol I will accept that Lightning just had a megaperm or something
i forgot to mention the "hovering" aspect of the hair for these games. no wait.. ALL games. blame it on technology. the ps3 and x360 don't have the power to produce realistic moving hair yet. sometimes it looks too floaty, sometimes it looks too stiff. most people just accept it is passable right?

maybe the pc has some games on there with amazing hair physics? the only game engine i could guess be capable of doing that now, is the CryEngine 2. the one responsible for Crysis. unless someone else has another guess?

[cheesepizza]

We accept =3= Just something to point out that could be improved on in the future (no pointing no progression :D)... It's just that everything else is soooo nice and the hair is BAM... blah hair bad or no I'm still getting the game XD

[1nOnly]

just because i'm not liking the shitty hair quality doesnt make the game bad:wtf: LO character models had better hair quality and it wasnt photorealistic, and if you wanna go with the "its an old build" then do so , its pretty ironic how some of you are telling me to get over it when you need to get over the fact that there's one picky bastard who just wont like what he've seen:cloud: so you get over it lol

[Hynad]

You're seriously getting obsessive about it. You don't like the hair in FF XIII. We get it.

Now would be more than due time time to move on.



(And just for the record, LO's characters didn't have any more "flowing" hair than Lightning's gameplay model.)

[Devegas]

and A-FUCKING-MEN!!!!!! we can move on to other things...... like how the demo will be out in the U.S. in june

[Lord Of Dumbasses]

Finally someone agrees with me!

Internet badass to the rescue.

He's gonna beat your ass with his badass Dante avatar.

And I'm gonna start with you...

[Astrozombie]

UH OH INTERNET TOUGH GUY GONNA GET ME. Please don't beat me with your photoshopped guitar.

You're so cool with your black leather jacket.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/picture.php?albumid=2&pictureid=7

[Thunder]

This is a fantasy based on reality.

[Naunen]

This is a fantasy based on reality.

----I doubt it's so with FFXIII.

[doeman]

and A-FUCKING-MEN!!!!!! we can move on to other things...... like how the demo will be out in the U.S. in june
is there any concrete proof on that???

[cheesepizza]

If they do decide to make it come out some time June... that must mean they are making progress on the full English game? (God I will kill them if they just get whoever voiced Aerith in English to do Lightning for the sake of it) We're happy with everything jap and all text in english though ya? XD

I hoped to play the game at the end of this year (understanding it as I play <_<) but SE shat on that hope....

[1nOnly]

You're seriously getting obsessive about it. You don't like the hair in FF XIII. We get it.

Now would be more than due time time to move on.



(And just for the record, LO's characters didn't have any more "flowing" hair than Lightning's gameplay model.)

i was just comenting on the reply to my post dear

and i clearly understand that they cant make hair CGI-like in gameplay but i just thought they could have made a much better job

[cheesepizza]

@1nOnly
They don't appreciate our (well at least MY) enthusiasm for perfection =3=

[Hynad]

If perfection was in front of you, you'd bitch about things it does better than you.

People like you always find stuff to complain about.

[1nOnly]

@cheesepizza
I really dont even think the things i/we mentioned about the hair is asking for perfection but everybody (besides you maybe) has taken it like that, like if i was complaining about something impossible.:wtf:

I at least can agree with the ones saying that the version is outdated and that i should wait for the final version before complaining but then again nobody knows to what degree the graphics will be polished (if at all), because all they stated is that they'll be polishing the GAME and not Lightnings hair lol

[Kokayi]

To me the best thing about the demo was the music, the movie scens and the exploration. Graphics pushed the PS2 tech just like 10 and 12.

[cheesepizza]

@Hynad
How to say this... Dude wtf? This whole dam game is better than anything I could do at the moment =_= and there is no "perfection", only something that is close....... we just want to get as close to it as possible and jeez... just coz you can't do something very well doesn't mean you don't know what's good from bad etcetcetcetcetc

*k end flame war k PEACE LOVE*

@1nOnly
Lightning's hair is part of the "game" :D *fingers crossed* And besides we will be exposed more to stuff like Lightning's hair than anything else (like billboards hmm?) so they better polish the hair! The hair!!

@Kokayi
I love the music too XD It's still awesome after so many listenings :3 Hopefully the music in the full game will be just as good.. and varied :D

[Kokayi]

@ the cheesyza

Yeah. I really want a few rock tracks, but people have said that's childish these days.

I also wish Lightning started out with Thunder. No FF character does. And with her name....*shrugs* Can I get an "Amen"?

[1nOnly]

@ cheesepizza (http://finalfantasy-xiii.net/forums/member.php?u=1835)
yeah let us hope that they include her hair as a part of the game but since the majority seems to think of us as being too picky I doubt that they will care to do anything about it, unfortunately

i thought that the music was perfect, it had an old school feeling but with an "excitening" touch.. and the voices was good, lets just hope that the english version is as good

[Kokayi]

the voices was good, lets just hope that the english version is as good

They went insane with quality VAing in 12. I doubt they'll drop the ball now.
I think the only FF of the 13s that might suffer is Agito. No offense, but I think so mush funding'll put to the two PS3 games that by the time Agito get out they'll only get great VAs for the leads of Agito. I'll still play it for story or course.

[Devegas]

yeah let's just hope that and hope that we don't have this fucking argument again

[Kokayi]

What's the point of arguing? We all like the same stuff. And even if we didn't in the end aren't we all gonna at least try out the game? And I doubt this is a stupid arguement. A dumb one would be buying in to that "who's faggier Cloud or Noctis" one. That's a arguement waiting to happen.

[doeman]

They went insane with quality VAing in 12. I doubt they'll drop the ball now.
I think the only FF of the 13s that might suffer is Agito. No offense, but I think so mush funding'll put to the two PS3 games that by the time Agito get out they'll only get great VAs for the leads of Agito. I'll still play it for story or course.
ff12 is on my top 3 for "best voice acting in a video game". all of the characters felt unique and convincing (well.. i thought penelo was "ok"). and i especially love Fran <3
her voice is sooooo sexy >;-D

[Kokayi]

Yes, Fran's voice was great to say the least. The best in the game to me. I also love the VAing in FF7CC. Genesis, Zack, and Tsung were done outstandingly! Which isn't to say the other character weren't great. The anime VAs were on the ball too.

[cheesepizza]

Yea XII was high on my list too :D I love Balthier XD XD XD I have issues with Vaan's guy though... he sounds so... *yeakthx I'm bored*.. in the dull-to-hear way O_o

And yea for CC, the VAs were surprisingly good :O Aerith was very well done... the innocent-happy-girl-ness. (Cloud's ARGGGHHH 'sounds' better in jap though lol but it's all good). Sephi sounds better in English imo lol sexier XD

Hope they go all out with XIII yay XD And I hope they don't overdo characters with American accents (no offense... but X was *ZOMFG SHUTUP TIDUS* .... just voicing my thoughts ._.)...

Well the demo = goodness :3 Sazh was awesome XD

[DrStein]

i read somewere i cant remember were xD that those transitions were just for the demo as i recall the same thing was in the ff12 demo but i could be wrong

[Astrozombie]

Graphics pushed the PS2 tech just like 10 and 12.

Wtf are you talking about PS2 tech?

[1nOnly]

Wtf are you talking about PS2 tech?

I didnt understand that part either..

i read somewere i cant remember were xD that those transitions were just for the demo as i recall the same thing was in the ff12 demo but i could be wrong

I think that its allready confirmed that the transistions will be there in the final version.. either way I dont mind them

yeah let's just hope that and hope that we don't have this fucking argument again

of all the arguments in this forums I thought this was actually speaking of less nonsense than usual, saying your impressions of the demo was the whole point of the thread.. people just didnt like mine:'( lol

[Kokayi]

Wtf are you talking about PS2 tech?

I mean, FF12 pushed PS2 tech really far.

[Falsate]

It's not that bad, don't see why people complain so much over a game. I hear the same things over and over "Yah-dah-dah, I hate FFX and FFXII.. and so on.." It's really not that serious, at all.

And anyway, it's just a demo.

[Kokayi]

I'm not complaining. I've liked just about every game I've played for one reason or another. And every FF did well, story wise. The only one I couldn't beat was 8. Ultimecia.....I respect her, but she so damn hard.

[Falsate]

I'm not refering to you, I'm speaking in general. I just hear the complaints everywhere and especially with my friends.

[Kokayi]

I'm not refering to you, I'm speaking in general. I just hear the complaints everywhere and especially with my friends.

I read you.
People are dissappointed in the wait and some hate what they see as "undeserved hype". So people are bound to say all kinds of stuff until the actual game is released here. And even then, most likely. It's EXTREMELY fashionable to hate FFs and FF characters. People often equate anyone who's a fan to a bandwagon follower of Christianity or any other popular religion. See where I going with this?

At the end of the day all that matters is what you think before, during, and after playing it. Nothing else. You either see them as good games or bad ones. Or okay ones.

[doomed_soul89]

I'm not complaining. I've liked just about every game I've played for one reason or another. And every FF did well, story wise. The only one I couldn't beat was 8. Ultimecia.....I respect her, but she so damn hard.

FFXII did not do well story wise, have you played VI-X? your party didn't even get split up, there was no character development it was lame, though above average for game stories way below for FF

[Falsate]

Actually, that is one thing i hate in some FFs, when characters leave the party temporarily. You may train a certain party of characters hard and suddenly they are on a leave and you have to struggle with the fights using a completely different line-up. Now I'm not saying that is the joy of the game as competition and hard work is probably what make FF. It gets annoying when you train a certain character and they end up MIA.

Final Fantasy XII actually departed from that (oddly). If anything, I actually liked that portion of the game. However, I have to admit that there was completely no character development in Final Fantasy XII.

[cheesepizza]

You mean KIA? lol (along with YOUR MATERIA OMFG)

But there was nothing wrong with the story (or gameplay for that matter) per se but it could have done with more character development there (Vaan stays stupid and Ashe just gets what she wants minus dead guy etcetc <.< yay for hundred hour gameplay) *sigh*

And yes... it does seem to be fashionable to hate FFs........... That and apparently it's fashionable among FF fans to hate the new ones and love the old........ *cough*

[Ikkin]

And yes... it does seem to be fashionable to hate FFs........... That and apparently it's fashionable among FF fans to hate the new ones and love the old........ *cough*

Well, that's what happens when you mess around with an established formula too much. =P Some people love it, and some people hate it but still like the series enough to stick around and complain.

And, really, XIII seems to be doing pretty well at not getting people to hate it so far. If the biggest complaint is about graphics, of all things... ;)

[Plastic74]

i think i might be the only one here that has not played FFXII. lol. after i bought my ps3, a couple days after it came out, ive been playing only multiplayer games. i was so close to buying FFXII until a friend told me all the 'flaws' about the game and not the good parts. i mightve missed out. but thats besides the topic. about the demo, i honestly did not find anything bad about the demo.. only thing that kinda got me like 'wait wtf.' was the battle song. it sounds really good until it cuts to this violin solo, or whatever, and it kills the feel to the battle

[Kokayi]

@ Doomed Soul
Okay it could've been better. But it showed effort. I've seen games that toss shit together just to have a game on the market. The only thing that'd be fun about the game would be battle. And a good story wouldn't need the party to split in order to focus on characters. I agree with LightninIIIX. The best thing about 12 was the huge cities and that boss battle music.

I've played Final Fantasy 6-10 and 12. Also play Crisis Core, Dirge of Cerberus, and X-2. I played but didn't get anywhere in War of Lions.

@ Cheesepizza
Yes. I loved 6 yet I still love 7. Why do so many fans act like you have to choose. The 16bit lovers say the new games are nothing but over-hyped eye candy. That's just not true. I think all of us saw promise in at least the majority of the FF series or we wouldn't be still playin' them and talking about it now. To me, 10, 7 and 6 had the best stories.

@ Plastic
Why not try out 11? I personally love that violin solo. The only version I have doesn't have that remix of the music. Though, I feel like recently no FF have any rock+roll in it. Or even urban style music. Are those genre consider too childish or non-epic to be amongst classical music in FF?

[Falsate]

Plastic74, you shouldn't have listened to your friend. There is no Final Fantasy game that can be that repulsive.

Some people love it, and some people hate it but still like the series enough to stick around and complain.

That is also funny and true.

[Plastic74]

Plastic74, you shouldn't have listened to your friend. There is no Final Fantasy game that can be that repulsive.
it wasnt just what he said. remember i had just got my ps3, so i was sticking with ps3 games. i thought 'well if its not that good, why waste money on a ps2 game when instead i could buy a ps3 game'. but reading this forum and your opinions on the game i might still just buy it. its a greatest hit game right now right? so it probably cost about 20$ lol.. i dunno if i like the weapon or level up system on FFXII. thats why i was 'egh' about buying it. but seeing as FFXIII might be the same (cause i doubt theyll be weapons to purchase) then i dont see why i still shouldnt buy it. btw, if anyone has any info about the level up system for FFXIII (i kno about the sphere grid) or items and weapons, please inform me . thx :)

[Astrozombie]

It's good that you took his advice and got a PS3. FF12 was one of the worst games I ever played.

[Falsate]

Either way, it's not so repulsive.

[Plastic74]

i never said it was 'repulsive'. i just thought twice about getting it and decided not to.
@Astro, everyone has their own opinion. maybe i might like the game, maybe not. but i still think i should try it

[doomed_soul89]

it wasnt just what he said. remember i had just got my ps3, so i was sticking with ps3 games. i thought 'well if its not that good, why waste money on a ps2 game when instead i could buy a ps3 game'. but reading this forum and your opinions on the game i might still just buy it. its a greatest hit game right now right? so it probably cost about 20$ lol.. i dunno if i like the weapon or level up system on FFXII. thats why i was 'egh' about buying it. but seeing as FFXIII might be the same (cause i doubt theyll be weapons to purchase) then i dont see why i still shouldnt buy it. btw, if anyone has any info about the level up system for FFXIII (i kno about the sphere grid) or items and weapons, please inform me . thx :)

I wouldn't waste my time, the game is really static, there are so many posibilites with strategy, yet there is next to no need for them because leveling is so easy, and the mist chains can be used again and again just by having an ether or being near a crystal, way too easy game for the growth system they used, and the story was bad, I know you don't need to get your party seperated to have a good game, but it makes the game feel more real, and it has twists and turns, not just go here do this, you can go back here but you don't need to, and those teleport crystals made the airship useless lol, and there was no good mini games so yea, if you want to you can buy it but will all the good games out now, I wouldn't waste the time

[Hynad]

Don't listen to him. FF XII is a great game! ^^

[Plastic74]

im gettin bored of my ps3 games. i have about 15 and if it wasnt for cod5 or disgaea3, then id have nothing to play. lol. please do tell if u kno of a good game worth playing that i havent tried. i still think im gonna get FFXII.. since rpgs take some time to beat. itll keep me occupied.

[Plastic74]

Don't listen to him. FF XII is a great game! ^^

ill never know until i try it, which i probably will.

[doomed_soul89]

im gettin bored of my ps3 games. i have about 15 and if it wasnt for cod5 or disgaea3, then id have nothing to play. lol. please do tell if u kno of a good game worth playing that i havent tried. i still think im gonna get FFXII.. since rpgs take some time to beat. itll keep me occupied.

Mirror's Edge is great, but short story, it's like the original sonics in replay ability shadow of the colossus is good (ps2) I'd get Persona 4 (rpg. ps2) before FFXII, yea not to many ps3 games yet there just starting to come out X-Men Origins: Wolverine is about to come out

[Falsate]

i never said it was 'repulsive'. i just thought twice about getting it and decided not to.
@Astro, everyone has their own opinion. maybe i might like the game, maybe not. but i still think i should try it

When did I ever say that you said it was repulsive? The point im trying to convey is that alot of the crowd will reject the recent installments of Final Fantasy.

[Plastic74]

Mirror's Edge is great, but short story, it's like the original sonics in replay ability shadow of the colossus is good (ps2) I'd get Persona 4 (rpg. ps2) before FFXII, yea not to many ps3 games yet there just starting to come out X-Men Origins: Wolverine is about to come out

i might have to check out Persona 4. but yea, ps3 is lagging on rpgs. thx for the game titles

When did I ever say that you said it was repulsive? The point im trying to convey is that alot of the crowd will reject the recent installments of Final Fantasy.

you didnt, but you said it twice so it just felt like that. i get what you mean tho

[Falsate]

I hope you enjoy it, I had heard alot of negative feedback on the game. I end up liking it a bit, but FFX was slightly better.

[Plastic74]

i just saw a few videos on XII. is it me or does FFX look better than FFXI & FFXII on graphics? and the fighting style looks a bit confusing:(

[Hynad]

The character models use a bit less polygons than those found in FF X, but the overall presentation is more consistent throughout and runs smoother/at a higher frame-rate.

Personally, I think FF XII looks better than X. There's this cohesion throughout the game that makes everything fit together perfectly. Be it the art direction, the character designs, dungeon's atmosphere, music, etc, everything fit perfectly together.

I'm a bit sleepy right now, so I may not be explaining all this very well. But I hope you'll get the idea of what I mean.

[Sundance Kid]

The character models use a bit less polygons than those found in FF X, but the overall presentation is more consistent throughout and runs smoother/at a higher frame-rate.

Personally, I think FF XII looks better than X. There's this cohesion throughout the game that makes everything fit together perfectly. Be it the art direction, the character designs, dungeon's atmosphere, music, etc, everything fit perfectly together.

I'm a bit sleepy right now, so I may not be explaining all this very well. But I hope you'll get the idea of what I mean.
Yeah, I think what did irk me about FXII's graphics was Vaan's abs.

[Plastic74]

The character models use a bit less polygons than those found in FF X, but the overall presentation is more consistent throughout and runs smoother/at a higher frame-rate.

Personally, I think FF XII looks better than X. There's this cohesion throughout the game that makes everything fit together perfectly. Be it the art direction, the character designs, dungeon's atmosphere, music, etc, everything fit perfectly together.

I'm a bit sleepy right now, so I may not be explaining all this very well. But I hope you'll get the idea of what I mean.

i do, but i also think Youtube made the game look like a ps1 game. youtubes video sucks.

[doomed_soul89]

i do, but i also think Youtube made the game look like a ps1 game. youtubes video sucks.

you need to go to the hq mode for them to be any good, but the graphics in XII where really generic in X there was so much more creativity and originality, although from a purely technical standpoint XII is better graphic wise

[Sundance Kid]

i do, but i also think Youtube made the game look like a ps1 game. youtubes video sucks.
Yeah youtube vids suck even in HD. It's not even HD.
:\

[doeman]

Plastic74.... my man... listen to me...... LISTEN!!!!!!!!!

- ff12 is a great game. personally, its my favorite one (though that may not mean much coming from a person who's only played 10, 10-2 and 12). the reason why i love it so much is because you can gain experience really fast. the game throws tons and tons of enemies at you and you can defeat each one in seconds (sometimes less). you said you own disgaea 3 right? level grind much? you'll love this game.
plus, all the battles are.... SEAMLESS... if you read my first post, you'll see why i'm a little disappointed about ff13. and if there's one thing that i didn't like about 12's battle system, was that you didn't really need like 90% of all the techs you learned lol.. just whack whatever's in ur pathway to victory!

- people argue about the story. "oh, its weak" or "oh, there's no character development".
the story here is more political and war based. its not ur usual fantasy where the main character has to defeat the main bad guy. however, i do agree that the character development could have been better. the MAIN character out of all of the main characters, Vaan, is just there along for the ride... through the entire game... it just feels weird seeing him not have that much importance in the story =/

- the opinions in graphics differ from person to person when talking about 12.. some people didn't like it because it wasn't as flashy as 10, some people DID like it because it did an amazing job of creating more realistic environments (especially for the ps2's generation). i'm definitely in the latter group. love how 12 looks.

all in all, 12 is a fine (and long) game. sure the difference in opinions sometimes get the better of peoples judgment, but the only way you can really find out, is if you play it for yourself right? if you're a ff fan, i say buy it. "great hits" discount right? can't lose much ;-D

[Sundance Kid]

Plastic74.... my man... listen to me...... LISTEN!!!!!!!!!

- ff12 is a great game. personally, its my favorite one (though that may not mean much coming from a person who's only played 10, 10-2 and 12). the reason why i love it so much is because you can gain experience really fast. the game throws tons and tons of enemies at you and you can defeat each one in seconds (sometimes less). you said you own disgaea 3 right? level grind much? you'll love this game.
plus, all the battles are.... SEAMLESS... if you read my first post, you'll see why i'm a little disappointed about ff13. and if there's one thing that i didn't like about 12's battle system, was that you didn't really need like 90% of all the techs you learned lol.. just whack whatever's in ur pathway to victory!

- people argue about the story. "oh, its weak" or "oh, there's no character development".
the story here is more political and war based. its not ur usual fantasy where the main character has to defeat the main bad guy. however, i do agree that the character development could have been better. the MAIN character out of all of the main characters, Vaan, is just there along for the ride... through the entire game... it just feels weird seeing him not have that much importance in the story =/

- the opinions in graphics differ from person to person when talking about 12.. some people didn't like it because it wasn't as flashy as 10, some people DID like it because it did an amazing job of creating more realistic environments (especially for the ps2's generation). i'm definitely in the latter group. love how 12 looks.

all in all, 12 is a fine (and long) game. sure the difference in opinions sometimes get the better of peoples judgment, but the only way you can really find out, is if you play it for yourself right? if you're a ff fan, i say buy it. "great hits" discount right? can't lose much ;-D
Yeah I put a good 200 hours into the game myself. The side quests really did it for me. I didn't think the story was weak at all honestly, and I am in the same yacht as you it's one of my favorites.

[Plastic74]

-well ive played FF 1-7 &10. including tactics and crisis core. so im kind of more of a fan of turn based. (alot of "of's" there) and yea i do level grind in disgaea 3. currently at lvl 2351. but i pretty much have to cause epilogue has levels with enemies at level 800-5000.. im not saying i dont like FFXII cause i havent even tried it. the seaminless battle type is something i havent tried either. it looks interesting but kind of confusing.. i also dont want to be overpowered for the story either.. the story plays a big part for me in FF games. i need to be kept interested or ill get bored of it. and as for graphics, its really hard going from hd ps3 graphics on a 1080p 46' to ps2 graphics.. i kno i wont lose much, thats why i might get it. i need to pass time until ff xiii. lol i kno, its a year until its released.. but for meantime i need an rpg. theyll be another map pack for cod5 in june and mw2 in november. hopefully these will help me through that long year..

[Sundance Kid]

-well ive played FF 1-7 &10. including tactics and crisis core. so im kind of more of a fan of turn based. (alot of "of's" there) and yea i do level grind in disgaea 3. currently at lvl 2351. but i pretty much have to cause epilogue has levels with enemies at level 800-5000.. im not saying i dont like FFXII cause i havent even tried it. the seaminless battle type is something i havent tried either. it looks interesting but kind of confusing.. i also dont want to be overpowered for the story either.. the story plays a big part for me in FF games. i need to be kept interested or ill get bored of it. and as for graphics, its really hard going from hd ps3 graphics on a 1080p 46' to ps2 graphics.. i kno i wont lose much, thats why i might get it. i need to pass time until ff xiii. lol i kno, its a year until its released.. but for meantime i need an rpg. theyll be another map pack for cod5 in june and mw2 in november. hopefully these will help me through that long year..
Yeah I'm the same as you, I prefer turn based/tactical RPGs. But somehting about XII just clicked with me.

Disgaea is an awesome game and series I take my hat off to you sir.

[Plastic74]

well im glad FFXIII isnt seamless. its like a mixture of turn based and crisis core. id say.. inbetween turn based and seamless.. i guess its safe to say that i will be playing FFXII soon.
and thx. it seems we have the same interest in those types of games

[doeman]

-well ive played FF 1-7 &10. including tactics and crisis core. so im kind of more of a fan of turn based. (alot of "of's" there) and yea i do level grind in disgaea 3. currently at lvl 2351. but i pretty much have to cause epilogue has levels with enemies at level 800-5000.. im not saying i dont like FFXII cause i havent even tried it. the seaminless battle type is something i havent tried either. it looks interesting but kind of confusing.. i also dont want to be overpowered for the story either.. the story plays a big part for me in FF games. i need to be kept interested or ill get bored of it. and as for graphics, its really hard going from hd ps3 graphics on a 1080p 46' to ps2 graphics.. i kno i wont lose much, thats why i might get it. i need to pass time until ff xiii. lol i kno, its a year until its released.. but for meantime i need an rpg. theyll be another map pack for cod5 in june and mw2 in november. hopefully these will help me through that long year..
the story isn't boring if you pay attention to what's going on. it's quite a bit on your part to remember all of the stuff that's happened, happening, and going to happen, but it never bothered me. *I* enjoyed it, soo yea..

just some fyi. currently, i'm playing Tales of the Abyss on my ps2. does the giant descent in graphics from new gen to old gen bother me? HELL no... what's more, is that i'm playing my ps2 on a HD tv. when you do that, the graphics come out even shittier (for it to be smooth, i need to play TotA on a ps3, or use a regular standard def tv).
i'm having fun with the game itself. how it looks has a 1% effect on me =/

[Sundance Kid]

the story isn't boring if you pay attention to what's going on. it's quite a bit on your part to remember all of the stuff that's happened, happening, and going to happen, but it never bothered me. *I* enjoyed it, soo yea..

just some fyi. currently, i'm playing Tales of the Abyss on my ps2. does the giant descent in graphics from new gen to old gen bother me? HELL no... what's more, is that i'm playing my ps2 on a HD tv. when you do that, the graphics come out even shittier (for it to be smooth, i need to play TotA on a ps3, or use a regular standard def tv).
I'm having fun with the game itself. how it looks has a 1% effect on me =/
Yeah I enjoyed the story to. Looks of a game rarely concern me unless it's hyped up to be the best graphics ever then I expect them to live by that but so long as the game is good I could careless.

[1nOnly]

there is allready a thread about FFXII...

[Astrozombie]

Upset cause they jacked your thread cause nobody wants to talk about "OMG LOOK AT THAT POLYGON" anymore?

[doeman]

"shoulders having a low polygon count"
^that's just taking it too far =/

p.s. - what's wrong with talking about 12 in here? there's already been plenty of other non-related ff13 topics in this thread =\

[Plastic74]

"shoulders having a low polygon count"
^that's just taking it too far =/

p.s. - what's wrong with talking about 12 in here? there's already been plenty of other non-related ff13 topics in this thread =\

lets not bring that conversation here. its just ridiculous.

[Kokayi]

Upset cause they jacked your thread cause nobody wants to talk about "OMG LOOK AT THAT POLYGON" anymore?

That's just mean, man. There's not need to start arguements. 12 had good and bad points. Let's Plastic decide for himself and let's stay on topic.

I still want to know Plastic, why not play FF11?
It's online. It's ps3 capable. It's an RPG. All signs point to yes.
Unless you're like me and don't like non-talking leads.

I have a question about the demo:

When they going to change Snow's fighting style? It seems like he's more stylish and sly than his fighting style showed. he moved like a brute. Though I guess he may just be a street brawler.

I like how Lightning tumbles when she fights. Not enough characters do that these days. Especially in comics.

I hope Sazh isn't a full time cahracter. I hope he's there to push along the story to the point where the full cast of leads arrives and that's it. I really only like Lightning and Snow right now. Maybe Lebreau as long as they don't make her say overly sex-related stuff. That ruins a female character in women and my eyes.

[Plastic74]

That's just mean, man. There's not need to start arguements. 12 had good and bad points. Let's Plastic decide for himself and let's stay on topic.

I still want to know Plastic, why not play FF11?
It's online. It's ps3 capable. It's an RPG. All signs point to yes.
Unless you're like me and don't like non-talking leads.

i saw vids of XI while i was looking for XII, and to be honest, i did not like how it looked at all. and from what i saw in the videos, the story looks like it could be boring. i dunno. then the graphics. some of you may not really care for the graphics but for me.. it has about 15% affect on the game.. i have enough multiplayer games already.

[Kokayi]

What at least you put thought into buy games for graphics. I can respect that.
Yeah, I like a good graphic game. But I won't keep one that looks good any is boring and annoying or just not fun. A lot of people say X is nothing but graphics. I won't argue with them. But I don't believe that at all. I play, about 95% of the time, RPGs. And so I focus on story and characters. Then gameplay and graphics. The lowest thing is music. I love sweet music, but if a game has bad music but is great at story and gameplay I'll keep it.

Are there people out there that hate a games' music so much they tossed it?
I once knew a girl so paid and picky, she threw away a game rather than tread it in. Don't think it was for music's sake though. The game, surprisingly was FF6 the playstation remake.

[Falsate]

I'm not sure if it's just me, but does anybody experience slow video movement when in HD?
(On YouTube).

[Kokayi]

Yeah. Let it buff out completely you do something else in another window. Then come back to it.

[doeman]

- i gotta say, ff11 looked boring to me too, but the main reason i never bought it, was because i didn't have a gaming pc. by the time it came out for the ps2, i just didn't care. its not like ff11 was one of those games that had everyone talking (like 10 for example).

- i'll take sazh over lebreau any day. her cocky ass attitude is nowhere near as cool as lightnings' and i'm pretty sure she doesn't have the skill to back it up either. and don't bet on sazh being some kind of supporting character. if anything, he's going to be a mainstay. he'll probably have a section of the game where he leaves for a while, but who knows. dunno why people are hating on him so much. i don't find anything wrong with the guy. his dancing doesn't bother me, his personality doesn't bother me, and his ethnicity defintely doesn't bother me (god forbid if it DOES bother someone...)

- i've never ordered the aspects of a game from my most important, to the least, but i'll give it a go.
1. gameplay
2. story
3. characters
4. music
5. graphics
through my eyes, if its not fun to play, then i'm basically forcing myself to play it. story and characters kinda fall in with each other (kinda kinda kinda..). i can live through a stupid story and forgettable characters if the gameplay is addicting. as for the music, it can go either way. sometimes i can't even remember 1 tune from a game, and then there are others that i can hum all day long. chrono trigger much? and like i said earlier, graphics don't really concern me.... well, unless they're "WTF bad", but i've never run into an incident like that.

[Falsate]

Yeah I put a good 200 hours into the game myself. The side quests really did it for me. I didn't think the story was weak at all honestly, and I am in the same yacht as you it's one of my favorites.

I put about 200 Hours in the game as well. The side quests were really cool especially Hunting Monsters (plenty of them were hard to find). The Fishing Mini game was ok, could have been better by moving around the overworld.

[doeman]

I put about 200 Hours in the game as well. The side quests were really cool especially Hunting Monsters (plenty of them were hard to find). The Fishing Mini game was ok, could have been better by moving around the overworld.
damn, i forgot to reply to that comment before. i have 170 hours on it and *I* thought that was allot =/
now there are 2 people who have more hours on it than me..

[Plastic74]

@doeman - i pretty much have that same order, but flip music and graphics.
that order refers to only rpg..
and as for the black dude, i dont think he could be one of the main characters. probably just a temporary character. he does seem pretty cool though... on second thought.. he may possibly a main character. theres not much info on any new characters. and why doesnt this site have him on the 'characters' section...???????

[Falsate]

You should probably give them feedback. I think you can using some sort of form on the homepage.

Under the Contact US page (use the nav bar).

[doeman]

@doeman - i pretty much have that same order, but flip music and graphics.
hmm... ok, i respect your opinion. lemme try and explain my decision to you in another way.

lets say we have game #1 and game #2.
- game 1 has awesome music. it's catchy, the music is always right at the perfect times, and it adds more emotion to the overall experience of the game.

- game 2 has awesome graphics. nothing else on the market can beat it, visually. the textures, the landscaping, the character models. it makes you wanna say, "damn.. this game has the best grafics evar!"

ok, now lets fast forward time --> 10 years later.

doeman: sooo plastic, how about that "game 2" huh? you loved that shit back in the day eh?

plastic: hell yea man. back then, those graphics kicked ass. but damn, now they just look shitty. dunno how i managed to play on those obsolete graphics back then. i can't imagine going back. (situation sound familiar?)
meh, enough about me, what about you and "game 1"?

doeman: oh... game 1? as a matter of fact, i'm listening to the soundtrack on my ipod right now. shit never gets old. classic. ah the memories~~
*continues to jam*

my point? music lasts forever, therefore music is more important than graphics.[/opinion]

YouTube - #15 - Corridors of Time (Zeal Theme) - Chrono Trigger
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfu0XBf8kmk)

[Plastic74]

You should probably give them feedback back. I think you can using some sort of form on the homepage.

Under the Contact US page (use the nav bar).

yea i just did. thanks for reminding me.

@doeman - i get your point. theyll always improve on graphics as time passes. and music stays the way it is. i guess for me itll always be the same. im always gonna move on to the next gen console and games and find it hard to play old gen games. but that doesnt mean i wont play them. if i enjoy the game(s) ill keep playing them... take megaman for example. id rather play megaman x4 - x6 over the ps2 megaman games in full 3d.. like i said, that order only refers to rpgs. on other games i can care less for the graphics cause the games are so fun. and might i add, the megman songs are awesome

[Kokayi]

- i'll take sazh over lebreau any day. her cocky ass attitude is nowhere near as cool as lightnings' and i'm pretty sure she doesn't have the skill to back it up either. and don't bet on sazh being some kind of supporting character. if anything, he's going to be a mainstay. he'll probably have a section of the game where he leaves for a while, but who knows. dunno why people are hating on him so much. i don't find anything wrong with the guy. his dancing doesn't bother me, his personality doesn't bother me, and his ethnicity defintely doesn't bother me (god forbid if it DOES bother someone...)

Being black I waited years for another black character to show up hoping they would be as cool as Cloud or at least Tidus. But when the time finally came, it wasn't just uncool, he was a clumsy baffoon. A comedian put beside the first ever complete badass female lead. It's like they couldn't break the mold twice. It couldn't be a sweet lady and a not annoying minority. You were getting one or the other.

Now I not gonna ruin this thread with an enormous race topic. I know people don't want to hear it. But no one can honestly expect me to respect Sazh after seeing characters like him in hollywood movies time and time again. Chris Tuker in Rush Hour. Loud. More bark than bite. No martial arts (until the later and usually for comedy). Race jokes even in dire time. Weak.

All I want is a black person (please a woman since guys seem like lost causes they've been ruined so much) that is a ninja or samurai and cool, calm, collected. Maybe make a few jokes. But mostly a badass and respected for it.

Or you know what! ANY "MINORITY". Let the Native American have their chance. Or Egyptians. Or Arabians. Or Indians. Or Enuits. ANYBODY. But no. Though I love them as characters. We continue to get the same. Japanese and white (european, australian, or from here in the states) characters.

I don't want to taint you idea of Square as a sweet video game company. I don't want to rain on your parade. I don't want to call people racist. I just want a black hero or heroine I can love as much as I loved so many white and japanese ones.

Like Gambit. And Wolverine.

Imagine is a character like Blade was in FFs? Would that not rock? Of course, I would make him younger. SO he could be the first black bishonen.

[Ikkin]

hmm... ok, i respect your opinion. lemme try and explain my decision to you in another way.

lets say we have game #1 and game #2.
- game 1 has awesome music. it's catchy, the music is always right at the perfect times, and it adds more emotion to the overall experience of the game.

- game 2 has awesome graphics. nothing else on the market can beat it, visually. the textures, the landscaping, the character models. it makes you wanna say, "damn.. this game has the best grafics evar!"

ok, now lets fast forward time --> 10 years later.

doeman: sooo plastic, how about that "game 2" huh? you loved that **** back in the day eh?

plastic: hell yea man. back then, those graphics kicked ass. but damn, now they just look ****ty. dunno how i managed to play on those obsolete graphics back then. i can't imagine going back. (situation sound familiar?)
meh, enough about me, what about you and "game 1"?

doeman: oh... game 1? as a matter of fact, i'm listening to the soundtrack on my ipod right now. **** never gets old. classic. ah the memories~~
*continues to jam*

my point? music lasts forever, therefore music is more important than graphics.[/opinion]

Personally, I think the real problem is that the only thing that ever became completely terrible was the graphics from the 32/64 bit generation.

Final Fantasy X still looks good today. Chrono Trigger still looks good today. Sure, you wouldn't be inclined to play them if graphics was the only thing you cared about, but as long as you're not dealing with a PSOne game, you're not going to be going, "ew ew ew" the whole time.

And I don't think that the PSOne was very kind to music, either. Something bothers me about the synthesization that they used. =P

Though you do have a point about the iPod. Music is a lot easier to enjoy over and over again than anything visual.

[Kokayi]

That was a really good point about the music lasting the test of time. I'll give ya that.

I try to go for the overall package. At least have more pluses than minuses. As long as an RPG has story, characters, graphics and gameplay that are good, I'm good with it. Music is a nice plus. But a game with outstanding music, can't you rip or buy the album? I mean if you REALLY wanted to.

[Astrozombie]

Now I not gonna ruin this thread with an enormous race topic.

Your post should have ended there.

[ExodusVII]

And I don't think that the PSOne was very kind to music, either. Something bothers me about the synthesization that they used. =P


I know this is a little of topic but MIDI was essential back then. You could store full songs in a few mere kb. It was great for disc space and still is. Look at modern Zelda games, they still haven't moved away from MIDI tracks and many Wii and some 360 games still use them. The orchestrated and piano arrangements of the original songs are what I listen to now anyway.

[Ikkin]

I know this is a little of topic but MIDI was essential back then. You could store full songs in a few mere kb. It was great for disc space and still is. Look at modern Zelda games, they still haven't moved away from MIDI tracks and many Wii and some 360 games still use them. The orchestrated and piano arrangements of the original songs are what I listen to now anyway.

Well, yeah, I knew it was done in MIDI, just like SNES and earlier games. But PSOne's bothers me more than the SNES's, for some odd reason. XD; And modern MIDI sounds a lot better than all of it.

Orchestral and piano arrangements are the best, of course. =D And that's probably one of the best things about Blu-ray - much less reason to avoid pre-recorded music.

[Astrozombie]

PS1 had awesome music. Fuck you in the face.

[doeman]

Being black I waited years for another black character to show up hoping they would be as cool as Cloud or at least Tidus. But when the time finally came, it wasn't just uncool, he was a clumsy baffoon. A comedian put beside the first ever complete badass female lead. It's like they couldn't break the mold twice. It couldn't be a sweet lady and a not annoying minority. You were getting one or the other.

Now I not gonna ruin this thread with an enormous race topic. I know people don't want to hear it. But no one can honestly expect me to respect Sazh after seeing characters like him in hollywood movies time and time again. Chris Tuker in Rush Hour. Loud. More bark than bite. No martial arts (until the later and usually for comedy). Race jokes even in dire time. Weak.

All I want is a black person (please a woman since guys seem like lost causes they've been ruined so much) that is a ninja or samurai and cool, calm, collected. Maybe make a few jokes. But mostly a badass and respected for it.

Or you know what! ANY "MINORITY". Let the Native American have their chance. Or Egyptians. Or Arabians. Or Indians. Or Enuits. ANYBODY. But no. Though I love them as characters. We continue to get the same. Japanese and white (european, australian, or from here in the states) characters.

I don't want to taint you idea of Square as a sweet video game company. I don't want to rain on your parade. I don't want to call people racist. I just want a black hero or heroine I can love as much as I loved so many white and japanese ones.

Like Gambit. And Wolverine.

Imagine is a character like Blade was in FFs? Would that not rock? Of course, I would make him younger. SO he could be the first black bishonen. hmm... i see what your saying, but i think you're prying too much into it. why does sazh seem like a typical "hollywood" black celebrity to you? as a matter of fact, why would ANYONE think of him as a typical "black guy"? because of the fro, quirky personality and dance moves he pulls off in battle?

first of all, african americans (like sazh) have hair that grow like that. in no way did i think negative of it. if you want to blame someone, blame tetsuya for not designing him with a hair cut. either way though, i really don't think it matters. his hair could've been braided for all i care.
secondly, you make it seem bad because his personality isn't "serious". Wakka, Tidus and Rikku from ff10 were quirky (and sometimes lame), but i bet you didn't have anything to say about their race back then eh? who cares if sazh has a personality like that. don't blame it on the color of his skin. what if sazh was some crazy looking ripped dood who loved to blow shit up? then there would be stupid people criticizing him saying, "oh, he's too ghetto. how stereotypical".
thirdly, i've said somewhere in this thread before that his dancing doesn't other me and why should it to anyone? it livens up the battlefield in an ammusing way. i read in one comment that in previous ff games, there were certain characters that moved more energetically than others. but WHY does it stick out now? because he's black? please...

my point --> stop crying

yea, i know ur trying to say that it would be "cool" to have a black character in a ff game that lived up to the awesomeness of Cloud, Lightning, etc, but honestly, sazh sticks out from the rest in his own way. why don't we give the guy a chance first, before hating on him eh?
the main FF games are made in SE Japan right? let them decide who gets to be who. who cares if all the characters look japanese... who cares if some characters look white... who cares if people think sazh is a stereotypical black guy... i wouldn't even care if they replaced their characters with something as stupid as Smurfs. we all play their games because they're fun right? nuff said. lets leave the "cool stereotypical black guy" to the american games.

and btw, "All I want is a black person that is a ninja or samurai". uhhh... lolwtf?

Personally, I think the real problem is that the only thing that ever became completely terrible was the graphics from the 32/64 bit generation.

Final Fantasy X still looks good today. Chrono Trigger still looks good today. Sure, you wouldn't be inclined to play them if graphics was the only thing you cared about, but as long as you're not dealing with a PSOne game, you're not going to be going, "ew ew ew" the whole time.

And I don't think that the PSOne was very kind to music, either. Something bothers me about the synthesization that they used. =P

Though you do have a point about the iPod. Music is a lot easier to enjoy over and over again than anything visual. i feel the same way about that generation. some of the games just looked like complete horse shit, especially the low budget ones. oh well, what could ya do? it was the first jump into 3d for consoles like nintendo and sony.
but even so, i tried picking up FF7 last year, but stopped an hour into it because the graphics were straining my eyes!!! that was the first time that evar happened to me. i put it off hoping that news about the FF7 remake (lol) would come true at E3 2008, but we got nothing.
to this day i still haven't picked it up, but i plan to once i beat tales of the abyss. i just... gotta play that game man.. i'm tired of everyone hating on me..

[Falsate]

Sazh is pretty chill. Although he looks like a 70;s character with the weird movements, he has potential. :P

[cheesepizza]

Lol doeman XD Play VII for the story and the lolwtf translations hahaha I'm still playing it in the giant polygon form :3 death to the mods!

And I agree with you on the black character thing..... "Black" seems to be a very touchy subject... Like the uproar with RE5 about shooting black people (A review I read said something like "We shot the Europeans, we shot the Americans, now its Africa's turn. Being black doesn't make you immune to infection"... which I found so true and lol)

I don't see how Sazh is a "typical stereotyped black guy" O_O. And only his afro can double as a nest for that chocobo of his (it's so cute :D). And as doeman says, someone is bound to pounce on his personality and actions no matter what they make him....in this case it was Koyaki...

And I loved and still love his dancing during battle... sad they're gonna tune it down a bit D:

[stalemate666]

Lol doeman XD Play VII for the story and the lolwtf translations hahaha I'm still playing it in the giant polygon form :3 death to the mods!

And I agree with you on the black character thing..... "Black" seems to be a very touchy subject... Like the uproar with RE5 about shooting black people (A review I read said something like "We shot the Europeans, we shot the Americans, now its Africa's turn. Being black doesn't make you immune to infection"... which I found so true and lol)

I don't see how Sazh is a "typical stereotyped black guy" O_O. And only his afro can double as a nest for that chocobo of his (it's so cute :D). And as doeman says, someone is bound to pounce on his personality and actions no matter what they make him....in this case it was Koyaki...

And I loved and still love his dancing during battle... sad they're gonna tune it down a bit D:
why are black ppl so sensitive anyways?

[Plastic74]

does anyone kno why sazh has a baby chocobo living in his hair? lolwtf

[doeman]

does anyone kno why sazh has a baby chocobo living in his hair? lolwtf
maybe he owned a chocobo and it died soon after giving birth? so naturally, as the "warm and kind hearted" person SE claims he is, he ended up taking it under his wing. (pun not intended)

[Falsate]

does anyone kno why sazh has a baby chocobo living in his hair? lolwtf

I've heard of chocobos being in the game, but they will not be for transportation. If that's true then maybe he is keeping one of the very last chocobos. Pulse could have creatures and menaces that kill!

[cheesepizza]

why are black ppl so sensitive anyways?

No idea... but (OMG DON'T FLAME ME) it might be an inferiority complex thing ._. When you feel inferior and are aware of it, anything ANYTHING that may hint at it will get you all flamed up... K I'm no psycologist but heh... You think other people think you are inferior? Kinda the same thing?

O the chocobo! With all the tech and flying scorpians and such, Chocobos are redundant D: well at least we will ahve one in the party...

[DrStein]

as if ya wouldnt have a chocobo in ya hair they do wonders for your scalp and ull never have nits :D....id just like to say for the black men out there ... FF7 barret was a rad character and he wasnt a joke ..

[Plastic74]

I've heard of chocobos being in the game, but they will not be for transportation. If that's true then maybe he is keeping one of the very last chocobos. Pulse could have creatures and menaces that kill!

yea i thought that too.. seeing as the FFXIII world is all futuristic, that chocobo is probably one of the last one left

[doeman]

yea i thought that too.. seeing as the FFXIII world is all futuristic, that chocobo is probably one of the last one left
i doubt its the last one left. cocoon probably has a couple

[Falsate]

i doubt its the last one left. cocoon probably has a couple
One of the very few that are left. What would they be doing with chocobos though?

Probably trying to get a rare breed making something like the Trickster in FFXII. :O

[Plastic74]

i doubt its the last one left. cocoon probably has a couple

i dont think so.. chocobos seem pretty useless in FFXIII.. i doubt theyll use them for transportation. theyre probably just pets.. or i dunno..

[doeman]

i dont think so.. chocobos seem pretty useless in FFXIII.. i doubt theyll use them for transportation. theyre probably just pets.. or i dunno..
well, i never meant to imply that chocobo's have a purpose in cocoon. i said that because since cocoon is kinda like a utopia, they might have a little bit of everything. i figured someone up there might own one as a pet like you said.

and if chocobo's *are* a dying breed, then i think its more likely to see them being kept well bred in cocoon, than in pulse where anything goes. eat or be eaten right? rules of the wild.

[Plastic74]

well, i never meant to imply that chocobo's have a purpose in cocoon. i said that because since cocoon is kinda like a utopia, they might have a little bit of everything. i figured someone up there might own one as a pet like you said.

and if chocobo's *are* a dying breed, then i think its more likely to see them being kept well bred in cocoon, than in pulse where anything goes. eat or be eaten right? rules of the wild.

my thoughts exactly! maybe the black dude (i keep forgetting his name.. it comes and goes. lol) saved one or something cause there arent many in cocoon.. one things been bothering me tho.. i cant help but think that theres something to do with the chocobo.. i mean.. whats the point in making it live in that fro..? why bring in chocobos to the story.?

[stalemate666]

I really don't think chocobo's are a dying breed, there isn't a world map though, since there not transportation, it's probably a big mini game/games and/or side quests, I don't think there extinct I just think there no where near the city, I mean Tidus didn't know anything about chocobos and they survived over 1000 years

[Devegas]

the chocbos r all probably on pulse and the baby just got seperated that's why it's in sazh's hsir because he hides it

[Falsate]

I really don't think chocobo's are a dying breed, there isn't a world map though, since there not transportation, it's probably a big mini game/games and/or side quests, I don't think there extinct I just think there no where near the city, I mean Tidus didn't know anything about chocobos and they survived over 1000 years

Where did you hear there wasn't a world map? Never read that before.

[Kokayi]

my point --> stop crying


Couldn't you have made your point without saying someone was crying. Did I even once say something like that to you? Please treat other as you would like to be treated.

As for Wakka, Tidus, and Rikku they're different because time and time again their race has been represented in much more positive ways. They themselves are more than just jokes. They are taken seriously by the cast and those that play the games. I don't see that EVER happening with Sazh. Even other japanese gamers were saying it seems oddly racist.

And with characters like Mifune in Soul Eater who was said through story to be an American white samurai (swordsman) how is it a "wtf" moment when I ask for that for a black character.

It a shame. I shouldn't have said anything. Because despite how polite I was in my post being sure to address the issue and not point finger and anyone here, I still insulted and my opinions tossed aside.

If you like Sazh, that's fine. Who said you couldn't. As for me, I DO care who Square decides get what personality. Because as far as I've seen certain races get more of the same. Certain races get mixed variety of personality traits ranging from cool to comical and all in between. But not true with so-called minorities.

I apologize to everyone if you all feel I "ruined" the topic. But I needed to say that. From my experiences I feel like it's time for a change. But I guess hoping Square or any company will do that for my people is just dreaming. I guess it'll take a more equality based writer from a more diverse and open-minded background to do that. Maybe even a group of minorities who are game developers.

If Plastic or no else has nothing else to say to me. I'll leave it at that.

[Hynad]

Barret wasn't your stereotypical black guy either. Unless you think any strongly built, cursing, prejudiced black guys are based on a tired black stereotype...

[Kokayi]

They admitted to basing him off Mr. T. Like anyone takes him seriously. Enough said.
If the roles were reversed, I think a lot more people around here would understand.
I like Barret, but I know it was low to make him so. If they want a black person to base a character off of how about Maya Angelo, Denzel Washington, Lawerence Fishburn, Huey P. Newton. Not characters from the A Team and singer. So one that can make a joke without being a joke.

I don't think I'm asking for much. Just one hero male or female that balck people can like with a shovel of shame to go with it.

[Hynad]

Dammit, why did they make Cid as a cursing motherfucker who beats women...

I'm so offended!!! As if they couldn't make that person a minority instead!! No, it had to be a white guy!!!!!!!!!!

So Typical!!


( you want a good black heroine, Play RE5)

[Kokayi]

I know all about RE5. Not the best example Hy.

Once a gain. Treat others as you want to be treated. I'm not coping an attitude with you, so please do that with me.

I'm simply stating my opinion and I'm getting plenty of harsh attitude from you and Doeman.
If you don't want to talk about race, say so. Don't insult the person in hopes that they'll just shut up.

Anyway, Japanese's isolated so they don't try to appeal to different types of people. They appeal to asian because they're their main consumers and to the RPG gamers of the US and Europe which are usually white males. So I understand why they do these things and sometimes play dumb when even they're own people speak against it. But I was hoping that my favorite company would learn from the changed times.

[Falsate]

It is time for a change. New console, expect new elements. My guess would be that from this point, they'll switch up so many things.

[stalemate666]

I know all about RE5. Not the best example Hy.

Once a gain. Treat others as you want to be treated. I'm not coping an attitude with you, so please do that with me.

I'm simply stating my opinion and I'm getting plenty of harsh attitude from you and Doeman.
If you don't want to talk about race, say so. Don't insult the person in hopes that they'll just shut up.

Anyway, Japanese's isolated so they don't try to appeal to different types of people. They appeal to asian because they're their main consumers and to the RPG gamers of the US and Europe which are usually white males. So I understand why they do these things and sometimes play dumb when even they're own people speak against it. But I was hoping that my favorite company would learn from the changed times.

Treat other the way I want to be treated, so I should force myself on hot girls cuz I'd want them to do that to me, and another thing, why are black ppl so sensitive, I mean we don't see white girls complaining about rikku being a stereotypic slut hell we didn't even complain about Zell being white

[Kokayi]

That's because those same people have been given MANY examples of the opposite. A character being seen as stupid when others around them of the same race of gender acting a much better light would allow anyone to divert attention away from the "dumb character" to the better one. For example, ignore Zell pay attention to Squall. Ignore Rikku pa attention to Lightning. Lightning + Squall being strong and smart. Understand.

[Hynad]

I know all about RE5. Not the best example Hy.

Once a gain. Treat others as you want to be treated. I'm not coping an attitude with you, so please do that with me.

I'm simply stating my opinion and I'm getting plenty of harsh attitude from you and Doeman.
If you don't want to talk about race, say so. Don't insult the person in hopes that they'll just shut up.

Anyway, Japanese's isolated so they don't try to appeal to different types of people. They appeal to asian because they're their main consumers and to the RPG gamers of the US and Europe which are usually white males. So I understand why they do these things and sometimes play dumb when even they're own people speak against it. But I was hoping that my favorite company would learn from the changed times.


RE5 not the best example? Shera is bad ass, dude.
But maybe it's the fact that we shoot black people that bothered you? Indeed, if that part of Africa was filled with Japanese people, maybe that would have made you feel better? But it's Africa we're talking about. And it's filled with black people. Not whites.


Did you hear any white people complaining that we were shooting the crap out of white people in the first few Resident Evil games?

In any case, my prior post was a sarcasm illustrating how persons like you will always find something to complain if their race isn't portrayed as anything other than bad ass or special in the coolest way possible.

You don't seem to realize, but your complain and attitude is a modern black stereotype .

[Astrozombie]

Why do black people always have to make a big deal out of anything involving race? Not being racist or anything, but wow. I don't complain every time Square makes every white(/asian) guy a total girly pussy. They made the character how he is because that's what they wanted, the fact that he's black is completely irrelevent.

[Kokayi]

Nevermind. It's just a difference of experience. Let's get back on subject.

With the demo, I felt like at least a few special attack should've been in it. I really liked what they had, but when Lightning took on the armored pope looking guy, I wanted her to finish him with something great.

[Kurai Warrior]

Couldn't you have made your point without saying someone was crying. Did I even once say something like that to you? Please treat other as you would like to be treated.

As for Wakka, Tidus, and Rikku they're different because time and time again their race has been represented in much more positive ways. They themselves are more than just jokes. They are taken seriously by the cast and those that play the games. I don't see that EVER happening with Sazh. Even other japanese gamers were saying it seems oddly racist.

And with characters like Mifune in Soul Eater who was said through story to be an American white samurai (swordsman) how is it a "wtf" moment when I ask for that for a black character.

It a shame. I shouldn't have said anything. Because despite how polite I was in my post being sure to address the issue and not point finger and anyone here, I still insulted and my opinions tossed aside.

If you like Sazh, that's fine. Who said you couldn't. As for me, I DO care who Square decides get what personality. Because as far as I've seen certain races get more of the same. Certain races get mixed variety of personality traits ranging from cool to comical and all in between. But not true with so-called minorities.

I apologize to everyone if you all feel I "ruined" the topic. But I needed to say that. From my experiences I feel like it's time for a change. But I guess hoping Square or any company will do that for my people is just dreaming. I guess it'll take a more equality based writer from a more diverse and open-minded background to do that. Maybe even a group of minorities who are game developers.

If Plastic or no else has nothing else to say to me. I'll leave it at that.
Dude Sazh is a badass in my book, did you see the part when they are on the train, he has not one but two rocket launchers strapped to his back. He is cool and fun at the same time. Hell I love the guy already.
Although he probably has a lot of bird crap in his hair :aldo:

[Kokayi]

Bird crap? Possible. I doubt people are thinking of that fact. People often forget about the reality behind hold a any animal, even cute ones, on you all the time.

I want chocobo to be rode once you get on Pulse Cacoon is a techno place, but Pulse is a wasteland of mountains and lots of monsters. I also hope Moogles will be in it too. If nothing else a shopkeeper or summon.

[Plastic74]

what did you mean by 'if plastic has anything to say about it' or whatever.. are you implying that i was gonna talk bad about your opinion.? no, i respect your opinion on the whole 'make a good black character' but you dont see me complaing about them not making a hispanic character.. in fact, i dont think there has ever been a hispanic character in the FF series. im not complaining.. let them do their characters their way. if the game is fun then characters dont really matter much.

[Kokayi]

I meant Doeman when i said that. But I think there should be a hispanic character. There should be great gay characters too. I think everyone should have a hero they can care about. But since no one seems to care, I'll let it go and suffer in silence. Bring it up hear is just gonna get people calling me "overly sensitive" and "emo" and what not. Even though I'm trying to be as constructive and polite as possible. I guess even when you show respect you won't get any on the internet.

Another thing I didn't see that I would've like in the demo: I a meeting of Snow and Lightning. I wanted them to a least have a conversation together.

[doeman]

Once a gain. Treat others as you want to be treated. I'm not coping an attitude with you, so please do that with me.

I'm simply stating my opinion and I'm getting plenty of harsh attitude from you and Doeman.
If you don't want to talk about race, say so. Don't insult the person in hopes that they'll just shut up. jesussss christ man. do you realize that in every other post, in every other thread, you say the same thing? its getting REALLY annoying. you're always claiming, "oh, respect and be respected. letz all be mature ok gaiz?", but all it looks like you're doing is retaliating like a little kid who's being bullied.

seriously, just... fucking... SUCK IT UP. if someone uses a little aggression or sarcasm in their replies to you, DON'T take it in a 100% bad way. you're only making yourself look like a damn crybaby.

- and about ur reply to me.
"They are taken seriously by the cast and those that play the games. I don't see that EVER happening with Sazh."
you've got to be kidding me. sahz is said to be one of lightning's older friends. why wouldn't a person with that role have some "serious" importance later on in the story?

[Astrozombie]

Stfu you whiny babies.

[stalemate666]

next you'll be complaining that all the slaves are black in a documentary

[Ikkin]

Lol doeman XD Play VII for the story and the lolwtf translations hahaha I'm still playing it in the giant polygon form :3 death to the mods!

VII's story and translation are probably just as much in need of a revamp as its graphics are. XD Not to mention the CG that can't stand up to Crisis Core's gameplay models.


I don't see how Sazh is a "typical stereotyped black guy" O_O.

Sazh strikes me as an attempt to do the opposite of what they did with Barret, really. He's a nice guy who got in a bit over his head while trying to help instead of a foul-mouthed revolutionary looking for revenge, and the comic relief aspects mostly come from him being in a situation any normal person would find insane rather than actually being incompetant.

I'm not sure I really like the final result, but I think it's more due to him being next to Lightning than Squenix trying to make Sazh incompetant. Being next to Lightning is kind of like being next to Sephiroth - in comparison with someone who's superhuman and graceful enough to make it look easy, even retaining your normal human self-preservation instincts makes you look weak. Snow messes up more than Sazh does, but getting people killed kind of disqualifies you for comic relief.

That said, it's been said that Sazh has some serious backstory, so hopefully that'll help keep him further away from joke character territory. =P

[doeman]

VII's story and translation are probably just as much in need of a revamp as its graphics are. XD Not to mention the CG that can't stand up to Crisis Core's gameplay models. woah, are you saying that the story in ff7 isn't perfect???? that's the first time i've seen anyone say that!

Sazh strikes me as an attempt to do the opposite of what they did with Barret, really. He's a nice guy who got in a bit over his head while trying to help instead of a foul-mouthed revolutionary looking for revenge, and the comic relief aspects mostly come from him being in a situation any normal person would find insane rather than actually being incompetant.

I'm not sure I really like the final result, but I think it's more due to him being next to Lightning than Squenix trying to make Sazh incompetant. Being next to Lightning is kind of like being next to Sephiroth - in comparison with someone who's superhuman and graceful enough to make it look easy, even retaining your normal human self-preservation instincts makes you look weak. Snow messes up more than Sazh does, but getting people killed kind of disqualifies you for comic relief.

That said, it's been said that Sazh has some serious backstory, so hopefully that'll help keep him further away from joke character territory. =P that's a pretty good way of describing how lightning stands out in comparison to people. i can't wait to see her and snow together in some scenes with dialogue. they both look like the "cool" type of character.
.
.
(but lightning will probably still stand out more cuz she's that uber kool)

[stalemate666]

woah, are you saying that the story in ff7 isn't perfect???? that's the first time i've seen anyone say that!

that's a pretty good way of describing how lightning stands out in comparison to people. i can't wait to see her and snow together in some scenes with dialogue. they both look like the "cool" type of character.
.
.
(but lightning will probably still stand out more cuz she's that uber kool)

The only problem I had with FF7 is that it didn't even hint that Tifa and Cloud fucked at some point during, I mean come on Tifa should of gotten some after looking after him when he was like brain dead, even Yuna and Tidus had the "kiss" in the lake that faded out to a scene of everyone who seemed to have been waiting for awhile

[Astrozombie]

If you really care about whether or not two videogame characters "fucked" or not, your priorities are fucked.

[stalemate666]

If you really care about whether or not two videogame characters "fucked" or not, your priorities are fucked.

lol, I just think it would have added to the story

[doeman]

hmmm... i stopped at "fucked". not sure if there are any spoilers after that =/

[Ikkin]

woah, are you saying that the story in ff7 isn't perfect???? that's the first time i've seen anyone say that!

Well, I never had a chance to play the whole thing, but I do know enough about it to know that at the very least, the ending needs a lot of tightening up. XD

Besides, even if the story was perfect, there'd still be some room to take advantage of the things the Compilation did right, especially in regards to the characters of Zack and Sephiroth. Zack's important enough to Cloud's characterization that the fact that he's a completely different person than FFVII implied needs to be dealt with.


that's a pretty good way of describing how lightning stands out in comparison to people. i can't wait to see her and snow together in some scenes with dialogue. they both look like the "cool" type of character.
.
.
(but lightning will probably still stand out more cuz she's that uber kool)

Isn't it? I find it funny that she's supposed to be a female Cloud, when she's got that intimidating aura about her that Cloud never had. She also apparently has the ability to be so dryly sarcastic that it's hard to tell whether it's a joke ("He means he'll give us a comfortable death"), which is always fun. ^_^

Lightning and Snow, as long as they both stay in character, are going to clash so horribly it'll be awesome. X3 There was a bit of dialogue between the two of them in that massive Jump Festa trailer (http://www.ff-xiii.net/boards/showpost.php?p=119753&postcount=22) whose dialogue got leaked. =3

[Plastic74]

where can i get my eyes on that snow and lightening dialogue? and translation

[doeman]

@ plastic - she posted the link to it.

- are these jump fest trailers only viewable in person? those places they call "closed mega theaters"?
because the only time i remember seeing lightning and snow together, is during this: "FinalFantasyXIII_DKS3713_Trailer"

you see them together in one shot at the end. some place where it looks like they're standing in the middle of an ocean that's frozen in time.

[Plastic74]

wow i need to pay more attention. i didnt see the clickable link
im pretty sure youve all been to this site http://www.square-enix.co.jp/fabula/ff13/ (its in the home page of this site) but they added a few things to it. sazh is in the characters section now, and so is team Nora. and there seems to be what appear as descriptions for the characters but its in japanese =/

[Daemon]

@ plastic - she posted the link to it.

- are these jump fest trailers only viewable in person? those places they call "closed mega theaters"?
because the only time i remember seeing lightning and snow together, is during this: "FinalFantasyXIII_DKS3713_Trailer"

you see them together in one shot at the end. some place where it looks like they're standing in the middle of an ocean that's frozen in time.

Yeah they're only viewable in the Closed Mega Theatre, at least to start with. The DKS3713 trailer was released later,but as far as I know, the trailer with the full 'crystal lake' scene hasn't, except maybe for sketches and transcripts.

wow i need to pay more attention. i didnt see the clickable link
im pretty sure youve all been to this site http://www.square-enix.co.jp/fabula/ff13/ but they added a few things to it. sazh is in the characters section now, and so is team Nora. and there seems to be what appear as descriptions for the characters but its in japanese =/

Sawry, but I think a lotta people seen it. They have battle system info now too. Just waiting on sections marked 'summons', 'world', 'story' and more characters now, LOL.

[doeman]

wow i need to pay more attention. i didnt see the clickable link
im pretty sure youve all been to this site http://www.square-enix.co.jp/fabula/ff13/ (its in the home page of this site) but they added a few things to it. sazh is in the characters section now, and so is team Nora. and there seems to be what appear as descriptions for the characters but its in japanese =/ damn, it feels like i've known about that for ages lol.

@ daemon - i realized this not too long ago, but our names are really similar. the "a" and "o" are switched. and i just noticed that your avatar is a cactuar mimicking Portal right? coincidentally, i happen to have a siggy related to Portal too.

nothing to pop bottles of champagne over, but yea..... that's kinda weird. at least you have good taste in games. viva la valve.

[Plastic74]

LMAO. well i had only referred to this site for info so its new to me!!!!

[doeman]

LMAO. well i had only referred to this site for info so its new to me!!!! me 2. i've been coming to this website for like maybe a year now? i just never touched the forums. it was only after i had something to say about the demo. i posted my msg on this other website that i hang out at, but i got shit little replies. figured i try out here.

[Falsate]

I want to see the lake scene. It looks interesting and could help us understand FFXIII a bit more.

[Ultima Death]

I'm not complaining. I've liked just about every game I've played for one reason or another. And every FF did well, story wise. The only one I couldn't beat was 8. Ultimecia.....I respect her, but she so damn hard.

Hmmm good times^_^

[Lady~Vengeance]

hmmm...I thought the lake scene was leaked by now...

[Ikkin]

hmmm...I thought the lake scene was leaked by now...

Only the sound. Someone managed to sneak in some kind of sound recording device, but wasn't able to get the video to go with it.

I think we'll probably get to see it in June when the US version of Advent Children Complete comes in, since it's supposed to have some kind of unique preview for FFXIII, and I doubt it means a translated version of the demo.

[Kokayi]

Sazh strikes me as an attempt to do the opposite of what they did with Barret, really. He's a nice guy who got in a bit over his head while trying to help instead of a foul-mouthed revolutionary looking for revenge, and the comic relief aspects mostly come from him being in a situation any normal person would find insane rather than actually being incompetant.

I'm not sure I really like the final result, but I think it's more due to him being next to Lightning than Squenix trying to make Sazh incompetant. Being next to Lightning is kind of like being next to Sephiroth - in comparison with someone who's superhuman and graceful enough to make it look easy, even retaining your normal human self-preservation instincts makes you look weak. Snow messes up more than Sazh does, but getting people killed kind of disqualifies you for comic relief.

That said, it's been said that Sazh has some serious backstory, so hopefully that'll help keep him further away from joke character territory. =P

That's the most construct post about Sazh I've heard since I got here. Bravo.
I don't completely agree with it, mind you. But I can respect it.

[stalemate666]

That's the most construct post about Sazh I've heard since I got here. Bravo.
I don't completely agree with it, mind you. But I can respect it.

oh get over it

[Kokayi]

I am over it.
The game developers are allowed to do whatever they want. I depresses me, but I've lived through worst. Part of it is our fault too as a people. 80% of the time, Black people spend divided making fun of each other and themselve. Africans usually don't like African Americans because of the foolishness us AAs usually get caught up in (fads, self-hate, greed for money, abuse of women, etc). So if I want the Japanese developer to care about Black interests, steps are likely need to be taken in order to unite my people and get them to care about themself and better represent themselves. I don't blame you all for not caring, if I wasn't who I am and raise by my loving parents I likely wouldn't care either. But I'm glad I do, because I can make a change for myself with my own comics and ideas. I can show my people in a better light with my own hands.

[Lady~Vengeance]

That's the most construct post about Sazh I've heard since I got here. Bravo.
I don't completely agree with it, mind you. But I can respect it.

How decent and mature of you! :D
More people should carry themselves like that, but then again
this is the real world!

ON TOPIC: I can't wait to see how Sazh develops throughout the game, especially since S-E announced that he actually had a family.

[stalemate666]

I am over it.
The game developers are allowed to do whatever they want. I depresses me, but I've lived through worst. Part of it is our fault too as a people. 80% of the time, Black people spend divided making fun of each other and themselve. Africans usually don't like African Americans because of the foolishness us AAs usually get caught up in (fads, self-hate, greed for money, abuse of women, etc). So if I want the Japanese developer to care about Black interests, steps are likely need to be taken in order to unite my people and get them to care about themself and better represent themselves. I don't blame you all for not caring, if I wasn't who I am and raise by my loving parents I likely wouldn't care either. But I'm glad I do, because I can make a change for myself with my own comics and ideas. I can show my people in a better light with my own hands.
or you could stop caring about race all together..., and you can't call me racist it once took me 20 minutes to realize I was the only white person in burger king, and yes I am Canadian so maybe that's just why I'm not racist, and I also believe your being racist by claiming their being racist when it doesn't even matter, plenty of reasons to hate, race isn't one of them, being an idiot who complains about ppl being racist to them on the other hand...

[Lady~Vengeance]

^ good point

[doeman]

and you can't call me racist it once took me 20 minutes to realize I was the only white person in burger king, LOL XDDDD

ya see, where i live (miami, fl), there is a huge variety of ethnicity here. shit, in my high school days, i even knew someone from russia! anyway, what's great about miami is, because there are so many races, nobody is really.. that racist...
i don't wanna say its the perfect place to live, but its not like, idk.. the central states, where seeing someone other than white is scary. (that statement may have sounded a bit ignorant. i apologize in advance for all those offended =D)

if someone does say something racist towards another, its because of the actual person themselves =/

ex: *hispanic kid cuts to the front of the lunch line*
random kid in line: "wtf, that spic just cut everyone!"

^lol, the kid isn't racist, just pissed. and i have no idea why i'm talking about this stuff, so i'll stop there lol ;-D

[Ikkin]

That's the most construct post about Sazh I've heard since I got here. Bravo.
I don't completely agree with it, mind you. But I can respect it.

Thanks. ^_^ And I think that your concerns deserve more credit than has been generally given to them, even if I do feel that the intention behind Sazh's design might have been something other than following a stereotype.

On a somewhat-related note - I paid more attention to the NPCs the last time I went through the demo, and I noticed that the refugee group seemed to have some diversity in skin tone. I don't know how much it means, but it looks like they're intending to avoid the "only black man in the world" syndrome that I'd heard mentioned in regards to Barret.


More people should carry themselves like that, but then again this is the real world!

The way I see it is, nothing can ever improve if the way things are is used as an excuse not to set higher standards for ourselves. ;)


As for the topic of racism, it's a bit of a mess, because of two major disconnects:
- One's words and actions are informed by subconscious thoughts that one doesn't recognize or even want
- One's words and actions, regardless of how well intentioned, may cause harm if another person subconsciously accepts the problematic implications of such

So, yeah, I think colorblindness would be ideal. I'm just not naive enough to think that just because I willfully intend to ignore race, my subconscious is willing to cooperate - and, when it doesn't, it's useful to know what the problem is so I can try to correct it.

[Lady~Vengeance]

The way I see it is, nothing can ever improve if the way things are is used as an excuse not to set higher standards for ourselves. ;)

touche, i never saw it that way :)

[stalemate666]

Thanks. ^_^ And I think that your concerns deserve more credit than has been generally given to them, even if I do feel that the intention behind Sazh's design might have been something other than following a stereotype.

On a somewhat-related note - I paid more attention to the NPCs the last time I went through the demo, and I noticed that the refugee group seemed to have some diversity in skin tone. I don't know how much it means, but it looks like they're intending to avoid the "only black man in the world" syndrome that I'd heard mentioned in regards to Barret.




The way I see it is, nothing can ever improve if the way things are is used as an excuse not to set higher standards for ourselves. ;)


As for the topic of racism, it's a bit of a mess, because of two major disconnects:
- One's words and actions are informed by subconscious thoughts that one doesn't recognize or even want
- One's words and actions, regardless of how well intentioned, may cause harm if another person subconsciously accepts the problematic implications of such

So, yeah, I think colorblindness would be ideal. I'm just not naive enough to think that just because I willfully intend to ignore race, my subconscious is willing to cooperate - and, when it doesn't, it's useful to know what the problem is so I can try to correct it.

Meh the way I see it saying jap online isn't racist it's just a faster way of saying it, and your only racist if you say all, where most just tends to be an observation of their racism making them conform to their races ways or a genetic factor like most black ppl have naturally black hair, which I guess is technically racist, but saying it isn't racists it's just true

[doeman]

i wonder if there will be racism in the world of ff13

[cheesepizza]

How is "jap" racist??

@doeman
It will start real and ingame flame wars ._. of course the former will depend on how it is treated in the game... but there has been... discrimination between... species O_O

[Jay_Z]

How is "jap" racist??

It's a racist term for Japanese people that started being used during and after World War II. A word is only as racist as you make it, but if someone is offended by it then is it really so hard to type out the word "japanese"?

[Zezlar]

It's a racist term for Japanese people that started being used during and after World War II. A word is only as racist as you make it, but if someone is offended by it then is it really so hard to type out the word "japanese"?

You deserve a medal.

[Falsate]

Like seriously, is it hard to avoid using the term lol.